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Oh come on... get real you guys (and gals...). This IS an interesting thread, only that it never came to a conclusion due to silly bickering amongst members... So... a conclusion perhaps, if I may (though others may continue as they please): 1. There IS some good music today, but appear to be: a. Buried underneath loads of garbage floating around today b. Be ignored because it's too good for the audience (and the audience is stupid?!?!?!) c. It missing out because the composer(s) are not doing enough promotion themselves (or their publishers?) 2. There also seems to be a consensus on what needs be done. We should train/educate the audience. We, the composers, or others more fitting than us (but who, I repeat the question which only two replied). 3. There is a disagreement on why we compose music, or rather who we compose music for. There seems to be two camps here: a. We compose music for ourselves, we remain true to ourselves and we do not sell out for the shake of anyone (the audience, the publisher, money, or other). b. We compose to please others and take into account the general publics' opinion!

You're not being direct. You're being disrespectful and insulting. There's a world of difference between, despite your lame attempts to deny it. Translation: you're stupid. Phil as usual. Yeah, sure, we'll buy that joke... You've be repeatedly singled out (see above posts) as the main troublemaker around here (not to mention you were even classless enough to derail a review thread supposed to be about the reviewed piece by jumping on a running joke I had with its author, among other beauties). I hate to say this, but it's time to be realistic: do you really think you're relevant enough as a composer, to feel alluded whenever I point out anything about the attitude of a certain number of relevant "modernist" composers? If you think you can look to us from above the shoulder, you'd better have something to actually show up for your pretended level of knowledge. Not just because you say so. That's not exactly your reputation (insert Dominus, Nikolas, Kefenziel and shoutbox quotes here). Now you can go on with your cynnical attempts to blame me, like other people are not smart enough to read the threads anyway. PD. Are you done editing the rudeness out of your posts to make it look like I've being the harsh one? Integrity at its best. THE END.

Adding to the percussion tips, your notation must be clear and consistent. I gave a seminar on writing for percussion once, and the mnemonic I came up with is "Hit what, with what, move to what." In other words, for any note, you should label the instrument being played, what it is being played with, and to what instrument the player will move to next. Many common instruments will have a "default" beater (such as sticks for snare drum or bass beater for bass drum), and as such the second step isn't always necessary, but even for instruments like glockenspiel, suspended cymbal, and marimba, you should specify the mallet you want used. The caveat to this is that most percussionists have spent years in band class playing music written by mediocre composers that had no idea what they were doing when it came to percussion, and have developed the skill known as "figure out how to make vague, impossible stuff work," so if you forget to say that the suspended cymbal part should be played with medium yarn mallets, the player will generally try a few things out and go with what he or she feels works best. Speaking of cymbals reminds me, you should err on the side of specificity. One of the most annoying things is to see some whole note in the middle of the staff with "cymbal" written over it, because I have no idea what type of cymbal, what mallet I should be playing it with, whether I'm supposed to sustain it for a whole note or hit it once, whether I should let it ring or choke it, etc. etc. Be clear with what you write. Score for players, not instruments. I've seen scores that were half percussion staves, because the composer wrote separate staves for wood block, triangle, cymbal, bass drum, snare drum, etc. even though, in performance, those parts had to be recombined into two or three players. Sort out the parts by person, give each just one staff, and notate instrument changes with words (e.g. "to wood block"). This removes the superfluous logistics step of laying out all the parts, then re-writing them for the performing forces available.

*applauds* this is all true, I played the oboe, though I haven't really kept it up, so it kinda sounds... weird now :P But I know all this. I really like oboes, as you can tell by my name, so I always have lots of oboes so I can keep it going for a long time :) A few viola things: Yes we can go above high C (2 octaves above Middle C). I wouldn't recommend it for orchestral works for extended periods of time, but in solo pieces, you can go as high as an A or sometimes even a C (I've played both) They have a unique sound, so don't be afraid of treble clef in the viola! F sharp major is okay, as long as nobody has to run all over the place like a chicken without a head. double stops are FUN! We like the C string. a lot. :)

Imma try to bring this back on topic, and I haven't heard the oboe addressed well, yet. Range REALLY affects the oboe's timbre, as it does almost any wind instrument, but I feel like the oboe is especially affected. Oboe does not play a true pianissimo below about a low D. We try our best but the tone down in the lowest register requires a lot of air and pinching the airflow, an important techniques to produce a soft dynamic since changing air speed does crazy things to tuning, will result in the note not speaking at all. Be careful when writing for the oboe in a soft passage. For me as a general rule, higher notes are easier to control softly. I would much rather be playing a pp high G (like, double high G) than a p low Bb. The oboe has an insane number of register breaks. C-Db inside the treble clef staff transitions from low register to half-hole (the first register key is not pressed down, instead the left hand's pointer finger slides to half-open that key). Eb (D#) to E above that transitions to the first register key. It's a break that is not difficult, mostly because we practice it all the time, but it does make rapid alternation between, say D# to E, difficult. In fact, that D# to E transition is one of the most difficult half-steps on the instrument until you get up above high C. G# to A (first ledger line) switches to the second register key (Note, the switch happens from G to Ab on english horn, which is the only fingering difference I know of between the two instruments, though I haven't played english horn much at all). This is also not usually something to worry about, but again rapid transition between G# and A are not fun. It's a trill that's never really in tune. I would never write it. High C to Db is about equivalent to the same break on a clarinet. Meaning, try not to overdo it. High F to high F# is ANOTHER break, and not a fun one at all. Really high notes on the oboe-more than two octaves above middle C (which we call "low" C btw) Yes, it's perfectly fine to write for oboe above high E. I just graduated high school and I can reliably play a high G, and a good professional can probably reliably hit a high A. I've seen fingerings for Db above that (but please don't get any ideas unless, say, you personally know Eugene Izotov :toothygrin: ). Tuning might be an issue but the player can figure that out. Now, just so you know, the fingerings above high C royally suck. They're really complicated and a half-step slur could necessitate the movement of four or five fingers, or use of alternate fingerings that are almost certainly out of tune (exceptions: High Db-D, high E-F, which only move one finger). DO NOT write extended sixteenth note passages above high D. Only someone like John Mack could play it and sound halfway decent. Endurance/stamina is really a problem in this register as well; I wouldn't keep your oboist there for very long. Endurance/stamina I feel like an oboist has less endurance than most wind instruments. This is simply my personal experience, from "losing my embrochure" in band rehearsal before my peers, or playing Mozart's Concerto and knowing that I have all the technique down if I can just sustain my air and embrochure through the entire movement (I'm still working on some technique in the 3rd movement). Try not to keep us above the treble clef staff for forever, although we can sustain it for a good while. Please don't keep us in the highest register for very long; it requires a lot of control and stamina to sustain those tones for very long at all. To get a feel for the endurance of a good oboist, look at the first movement of Mozart's concerto (there are public domain copies floating around the web, and I even have one on my computer :toothygrin: ). Notice where Mozart gives the soloist a break, and try not to write passages of continuous playing for much longer than that. Trills/alternations not to write: Low Bb to B. This is just impossible. It's a really awkward slide of the left pinky. A higher Bb to B is possible, BUT it's also an awkward hand position, so add a rest at the end, not ornaments. G# (Ab) to A is possible but not very well in tune. Low C to low Db trill is supposed to be possible with an extra low C key but it requires an awkward finger position on a key that usually has a GIANT hole in it. I still can't reach the key without partially uncovering the hole (and then nothing speaks!). Repeated A to C or G to Bb is annoying. That's about it. A final interesting note that's vital for any general music teacher working with an ensemble that contains oboists: The double reeds are the ONLY wind instruments that DO NOT have any sort of tuning mechanism to physically adjust on their instrument. The oboe is designed to be played with all body pieces, and the reed, pushed all the way in. Never tell an oboist to adjust the position of their reed. They have to adjust their embrochure or get a better reed.

OBOE SHOULD NOT GO ABOVE HIGH E!!!!! :angry: the one 2 octaves above middle c, that is.

"On violin beginning with the D on the third string all intervals of a second, a third, a fourth, a fifth, a sixth, a seventh, an octave are practicable. But they get more and more difficult in proportion as they advance on higher strings" That's a quote from Berlioz's treatise on orchestration and it covers pretty much all the instruments you could want to write for and instruments that I don't think are used any more. It's a good book and I've learnt a lot from what I've read however I have a 261 page pdf and he does use some instrument names that weren't familiar to me i.e hautboy (called an oboe now-a-days). However if you want a copy that only talks about instruments that are still in use and is condensed to state things in a shorter easier to understand way there are condensed versions on the internet. http://www.hberlioz.com/Scores/BerliozTreatise.html Heres one condensed version I used before finding the whole thing in pdf Hope I've been some help