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I read through the rules of applying for lessons and noticed most teachers are not open for more or any lessons. Would this forum also be a place to informally ask questions of my own studies in music?

I, in fact, am not looking for a teacher really... simply an open forum of educated musicians to fill in the gaps in my own pursuits.

Instance: I have decided to study the Bach Chorales in order to deepen my understanding of harmony, but have ran into some questions. I also don't foresee how often I would be seeking guidance as I am fairly busy a pursuing theory/composition independently from my formal education (Music Education Major).

In anticipation that this hopefully can be an open forum: My first question.

I have decided to start with analyzing BWV 281. Even though these are all under public domain, I don't fully understand publishing copyrights even if the publisher is handing them out for free... I used this site to acquire the Chorales: JSBChorales.net: Bach Chorales. If this site does not mind me posting my analysis of the Chorale via sib or pic, I would gladly do so to make this easier for those helping.

Regardless... My analysis and questions:

I | I V V7/IV IV | V [V I]

IV | I viidm7 I [V | I]

*** IV | V7 I ii v7/ii | ii7 [V I] ***

I | viid I ii7 V(7?) | I

Explanation of 3rd phrase. It seemed extremely confusing to continue analyzing in F Major with all of the mm7 chords. Unless it was a utilizing the circle of 5ths progression, it was easier to assume had was just using a secondary key momentarily. The secondary key being C Major made much more sense. In the key of F Major and between all of the mm7 chords I couldn't find a chord progression following the rules. Please... COMMENTS!!!

I have been out of formal theory classes for a year and hope continuing to analyze will help me with both composition and music in its entirety. My other goal associated with analyzing these chorales will be to play the chorales game: http://www.youngcomposers.com/forum/chorales-yay-18165.html. Actually looks like a bit of fun.

Thank you all again and I look forward to responses.

P.S. I do not foresee my posts being this long in the future. ;) Thank You!!!

I noticed the missing teachers as well... was hoping to apply :(

I just had a quick look at it, but I generally agree with your analysis. One could get a bit more detailed with also notating inversions, suspensions and the like, but you have the core quite fine. (I'm also not too familiar with the American notation for harmonic analysis - it may be well possible that it's just not customary to write these things there.)

Concerning your third line: It's true that it probably makes most sense to read it in a C-major context. It is a very short segment however, so personally I wouldn't analytically write that part down in C-major. You could write the harmonies on that line (i.e. from the middle of bar 4) as a series of intermediate functions that all lead to the final C-major chord (i.e. "V" in F-major) under the fermata of bar 6. I'm not sure how one writes such things in your notation system, but since you wrote the intermediate functions generally in the form of "V7/IV" etc. one could write for the third line:

(IV | V7 I ii v7/ii | ii7 V)/V V, signifying a group of harmonies that all is to be read relative to "V" of F-major.

Since we may want to make this section of intermediate functions as short as possible, we can also take note that this part is still readable relative to F-major for the first few beats: I V7/V V7 VI. After this (i.e. on the a-minor chord), I would go in the intermediate function group: (vi ii7 V)/V V.

(You also see that I replaced your v7/ii with a simple vi, which I think more plausible than a secondary dominant in minor.)

So personally, I'd write the third line like this:

I | V7/V V7 VI (vi | ii7 V)/V V.

There are however many different methods there. Some schools modulate to a different key much more quickly and will write down a different key as soon as a couple of chords fall outside the main range of your primary key, whereas others try to keep the main key as long as possible. Personally, I tend not to set a new key unless it has been first stabilized by some sort of cadence. In this case there certainly -is- a cadence to the C-major chord in bar 6, but it only appears at the very end of it, so by the time C-major gets stabilized by the cadence, it's already over again.

I am thinking being a teacher here-Once I finish some compositions that I am working on.

Gardener-

Thank you a great deal for your response. Typically I do include inversions NCTs, and cadence type in my analysis. The paper printed off in fact is full of them. Skipped it for the sake of focusing on what I was really curious about... the 3rd line. I actually had a very hard time deciding to use C Major as I agree with all of your statements. Including the brevity of the piece overall and the the cadence ending the phrase establishing the key change immediately ends with the phrase immediately following.

My concerns or lack of knowledge makes me curious about how you stated you would analyze this. First if someone would be kind enough to re-introduce me to the function of mm7 chords in the CPP I would be greatly appreciative (I understand ii7 V I, my understanding fades from there). Secondly... I never did quite understand if a secondary dominant could disrupt the flow of harmonic progression or if it is only allowed to make the pull stronger? For instance, with your suggested analysis, all of the ***/V section is pulling to V from vi. From what I've understood vi to V is generally not an accepted progression.

Truly... I like how you wrote this and would take this approach:

(IV | V7 I ii v7/ii | ii7 V)/V V, signifying a group of harmonies that all is to be read relative to "V" of F-major.

Thank you again... and though I question some of your thoughts... it is simply to understand them. I have already found your information INCREDIBLY useful. Thank you!

Well, ii7 in a major key is probably by far the most common use of mm7 chords. It sometimes also appears as vi7, but that's mostly the case when it's used in modulation/relation to the dominant, which again would make it an ii7 of the dominant. Similarly, it can often be used in a minor key as iv7 (or even in major), which sometimes is also is used ambiguously as a ii7 to the parallel major key.

But technically there's no strict limit to the contexts it could be used in, if it makes sense from the voice-leading.

Concerning secondary dominants disrupting the harmonic flow: That is again a question of voice leading and the harmonic "distance" that lies between the harmony you're coming from and the secondary dominant, which again also depends on the distance to the harmony this secondary dominant leads to. But in general, when you can go directly to a harmony without problem, you can also insert a secondary dominant inbetween, without breaking the flow at all. Actually, secondary dominants often have the effect to strengthen the harmonic cohesion and thus the "flow".

Concerning my (…)/V section: No, I didn't mean with that strictly that it's pulling to V from vi. First of all, this is a "vi/V" not "vi", so actually it's pulling from a temporary iv towards a temporary I.

Second, the exact place where I started the brackets with the intermediate functions is, as in most cases, a bit ambiguous. Often, in such "modulations" there's not just a single chord that leads from one "key" to another, but a series of ambiguous note that can be read in one or the other context. Putting this whole line in brackets is probably quite as acceptable as starting with the "vi", or another chord in this neighborhood. The point is: It's ambiguous where the actual "modulation" starts, so don't place too much weight on the first chord within the brackets. It doesn't mean it leads from -there- to the final destination, just that it's practicable to start at this point. If a chord is still easily describable in the main key, I will usually also analyse it like that and only go into intermediate functions when necessary. That's all.

So no, I didn't mean it's "pulling from vi to V" (or from vi/V to V). I simply start reading the chords in the context of V from this point on, which still doesn't make it a felt progression of vi to I, or vi/V V (and certainly not vi to V).

I hope I'm not talking terribly unclearly here. Talking about harmony on the internet can be somewhat obscure.