Revised Rules and Code of Conduct

But how is that the forum's problem? If people say they are over 13 when they register, isn't that enough legally? If they lie, it's their problem, not ours.

Or is this about morality too? That you (the administration) can't morally subject an 11 year old to this regardless of who is liable?

I agree. I don't know the reason why they choose to not do that, but i'm sure if we asked we'll get another around the world answer that answers nothing. So as is custom in yc, it doesn't happen because it doesn't happen.

Look, I think all that the rule

While interacting with other members of the YC community.......

is trying to say is that people should be respectful and curteous towards one another. People are still allowed to have opinions, but they must present them respectfully and make sure it is obvious that it is just their opinion and not fact! Surely there is nothing wrong with this!?

It is not an act to supress everything that is disagreeable, it is an act to supress that which would supress! Discussions were constantly being ruined by people who could not cope with reading differing opinions and would simply patronise and offend to the point at which people no longer would want to share their opinion. Now we must all cope with those opinions, because we have to be respectful.

If anything this rule encourages free speech; it encourages respectful opinion sharing and discourages anybody that would ruin a healthy, informative debate for selfish reasons. (This is how I'm looking at it). Maybe we have sacrificed the ability to write things like "You are stupid", but by doing so we are encouraging an environment in which people actually would want to be a part of.

If you don't want to be a part of this, I question your motives!

It depends. Different people have different reasons. Not everybody simply wants the right to be disrepectful, but I think by discouraging disrespect YC will encourage respect for others opinions and therefore people will feel that they have more freedom. I don't see it as a Big Brother scenario if the intent is one of social responsibility rather than repression.

You can't force social responsibility. Despite these rules, he won't get what he wants.

It seems to me that Porcaro knows very little about how to deal with people. The answer is not to simply suppress everything that you find disagreeable.

I don't think most people come here simply because they want help writing music. I was under the impression people came here to also socialize with fellow musicians. I thought that was a big reason why you wanted to integrate a social networking component.

It seems however that you want people to come here, talk about each other's music, and pretend that nothing else matters.

People aren't allowed to be upset, or overly opinionated, or outspoken.

Porcaro is a prime example of how a well intentioned leader with total control can destroy the very thing he is trying to foster.

I remain here for one reason now, and that is for connecting with musicians.

I no longer dare to socialize on the forum, because such activity is obviously frowned upon.

Big Brother is watching.

porcaro WANTS you to socialize respectfully.

you want to socialize disrespectfully.

you can have strong opinions and still be respectful...

You make quite a logical jump. Dom simply wants the ability to express what he wants to express and how he wants to express it. Somehow, I don't find being disrespectful inherently bad. There's been a many committee meetings that I have attended where being disrespectful to other people got the ball moving. If you feel like you have to restrain yourself in any social context, more often than not what you need to say or do become muddy for the sake of decency.

I really really have tried to hold my tongue but I cannot.

Look, here is one profoundly simple suggestion for ALL of us:

TRY TO FOLLOW THE NEW RULES BEFORE CATEGORICALLY CONDEMNING THEM OR LOSING YOURSELF IN TORTUOUS DEBATES OVER FREE SPEECH AND SEMANTICS.

But why?

Now you say that :P

Imagine how you would have felt 5 years ago...

Or wait.. do you mean an age cap, then?

Purge the enemies of the state!

I've read some past posts...I want to throw up in embarrassment.

Hahaha. I was 15 when I joined and I have the same reaction to my early posts. I can't believe I was that obnoxious, illiterate, and blind to the world :blink:

Hahaha. I was 15 when I joined and I have the same reaction to my early posts. I can't believe I was that obnoxious, illiterate, and blind to the world :blink:

I think this might be a common thing/reaction. I used to frequent on another site (music-scores.com) and a couple of times after I had left I had to use the search facility to find some old scores of mine and reading some of my posts I couldn't believe I was so immature and how I had no idea at all of what I was talking about... Very embarassing, indeed.

Alexandros

But why?

So much for avoiding petty squabbles.

So much for avoiding petty squabbles.

YEP! I know you and I are in the same boat because you're doing what I'm doing.:cool:

This will most likely be my last message on this forum.

Not.

YEP! I know you and I are in the same boat because you're doing what I'm doing.:cool:

Well, snap.

Well, I think I was technically 14 when I entered. Which is probably the age I would have suggested to cap off at. Although I sincerely hope we don't get anyone on this site ANYTHING like the 14-year-old me. I've read some past posts...I want to throw up in embarrassment.

:shifty:

Nico. You are my friend now and all... but my first impression of YC was based on a review of my first piece/first attempt at composition... ever - a review written by 14 year old you. After being here less than 48 hours I actually almost asked to have my account deleted because the place didn't seem "beginner friendly" and actually abusive. Luckily other people stepped in and basically kept me from quitting... one of those people being chopin. So yes, I know first hand what you were like back then ;)

That right there is what we are trying to prevent :P

You can't stop kids from being kids. That's just going to make every admin/ mod look a little unintelligent and rude...

I'm surprised I'm still allowed to post in the shoutbox due to the potentially "offensive" and "obscene" nature of my username.

Anyway, I won't complain about the new rules but I do believe that what Chopin is doing is ultimately for the worst. Maybe not so much the rule themselves as the execution of them... more and more posts are disappearing (many of which don't actually appear to even violate any of the new rules) and quite clearly, free speech does not exist here anymore. I won't complain because A) I know it makes absolutely no difference and B) I'm going to continue staying here anyway... no need for any of that pesky drama that unfortunately, many of the peope I considered to be "cool" on this forum to succumb to. The only thing I have to say is... just because you have the RIGHT to do something does not mean that it is the RIGHT thing to do.

I've never had a problem with Chopin and I still do not. He may run his forum in whatever way he sees fit and there is nothing anyone can do about it... I just think he should have a clear goal of what kind of company he really wants to keep here and what kind he is going to attract with these rules.

Just my two cents.

P.S. It'll really be a testament to the new moderation if this post gets censored in some way... can't say it'd surprise me.

And of course, I sincerely do say this with all due respect.

You can't stop kids from being kids. That's just going to make every admin/ mod look a little unintelligent and rude...

We can't stop them from being "kids", but we can stop them from being disrespectful.

No you can't stop them from being disrespectful, you can only hide it and hope it doesn't happen. Don't confuse punishment with prevention.

Nico's right. It is not necessary to dumb this site down (no offense) to a child-like area. You should put a disclaimer that the median age around here IS 20 and that parents should know the matter contained here will reflect that.

It's not a matter of "dumbing down".... rather a pruning of unnecessary rudeness.

If you simply tailor your actions to what you might do in the presence of, say, a policeman or a priest, we'll all be happy.

If you simply tailor your actions to what you might do in the presence of, say, a policeman or a priest, we'll all be happy.

Mmm... I love the sound of deep, dark sarcasm in the evening.

Funny how the Mods here have no trouble "putting rude kids" in their place (often by being rude themselves), yet when somebody comes with a real argument against what they are doing, they become mysteriously silent.

I don't feel safe here, and it doesn't have anything to do with the rude behavior of some 11 year-old. As much as I find rude speech annoying, I find that what the Mods are doing now is far worse. And if that is the price we are required to pay for a clean forum, I say the price is too high.

Yes, I know that nothing I'll say is going to change anything. Nevertheless, it is important for me to state how I feel about the whole thing.