What chords/tricks do you use when improvising?

I was improvising some piano duets with my friend the other day where one of us would play the melody on top and the other would play some chords or arpeggios on the bottom. It's fun. I also enjoy improvising by myself.

I was wondering how I could improve my improvising skills.

Here are some of the lame methods I use:

Whatever chord I hear in my head, or whatever chord it's supposed to be, I like to add a seventh or a second to the chord. Or both a seventh and a second. (which makes it a 9th chord) This instantly makes the chord sound better.

I also have a lot of substitutes for the dominant I like to use. If the key is in C major or C minor, I might use Dm6/G, (which is actually G9) Ddim7/G, G7+, Fmaj7/G followed by Gmaj, or random-black-notes/F# followed by Gmaj.

There are also a lot of chords that are nice for ending an improvisation and are better that just the plain tonic chord. Again if the key is C major or minor, I use CM6, Cm♮6, Cm♮6 where the top note is changed for C to D, Em(first inversion)/C, Cm9 with a major 7th... That's about it I think.

I'm sure you people must have a hundred more better ideas then me. Hopefully by the time everybody shares their chords or tricks, we will all be geniuses at improvising.

First off, I never think about what chords I'm gonna use next. Because I'm IMPROVISING. The question you're asking is basically "how do I plan an improv?" If you plan it out, it's not an improvisation.

Anyways, I usually start out with a basic key center and do whatever's harmonically and melodically interesting. That's about as far ahead as I plan. The only other thing I sometimes think ahead about is the mood I'm trying to convey, and how to go about it. I.e., if I want to play something depressing and deathly, I'll often emulate sounds of things that remind me of death: Final heartbeats/breath, church bells, processions, and the mysteries of the afterlife.

I'm just lurking and will continue to do so. But I have to say something here.

The question you're asking is basically "how do I plan an improv?" If you plan it out, it's not an improvisation.

I've been improvising on trumpet for about 3 years now in combo and big band; also taken lessons and a jazz theory class. This issue of 'practice/planning' has come up more than a few times.

There is indeed practice and advanced thinking that goes on in a good improvisation. If you've never practiced it, you can't play it. If you're not thinking ahead as you do it, then you are taking a big risk in playing something that goes nowhere or goes someplace ineffective.

Just like in every aspect of performance, if you don't practice doing it alone then you don't have any business doing it in front of an audience.

The reason I started this thread was because I wanted to expand my knowledge of chords. Alex, certainly you must have memorized chords that are suitable for the mood you want to convey. Like minor chords sound sad, and major chords sound happy. i find the chords I listed above very useful and I use them very often. Maybe you have some chords you like to use often, or have some advice in improvising for me.

The thing I really want to do is to spontaneously produce nice sounding chords to accompany a melody. (Often a well-known one)

be honest to yourself and don't call it improvisation. You'll want to study reharmonization techniques.

get the thought "minor chords sound sad/major chords sound happy" out of your head. It's limiting, narrowminded and wrong!

You'll want to study reharmonization techniques.

Bingo.

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Ian,

From your description, it's jazz theory that you'll need to practice. Buy any book by Mark Levine and use it.

be honest to yourself and don't call it improvisation. You'll want to study reharmonization techniques.

get the thought "minor chords sound sad/major chords sound happy" out of your head. It's limiting, narrowminded and wrong!

okay then, I guess what I want is reharmonization techniques. I have the impression that when a person improvises he uses chords from the chord library in his head, and as he plays more the chord library gets bigger and he gets better at improvising. I'm trying to expand my chord library, I guess.

As for the major-sounds-happy-minor-sounds-sad thing, I was trying to make the point that you use certain chords for certain effects.

I think you worded it all fine.

I definitely have certain techniques I use. I'm paying attention to two things, the root tone on the bottom, and the top melody note. Sometimes the melody is on the bottom, the root on the top, but it's fun to just use 2 notes to improvise, or to just play at all, then just add on to those 2 notes after you get really good with playing with your two pointer fingers.

My improvisation technique comes from just moving the two notes around.

Another way is to just get really really good at scales. If you practice 10 minutes a day on scale drills, in like...2-3 years you get to the point where you're a master. It sounds like a lot, but 10 minutes a day is so little, the time just flies by.

On an instrument that only plays one note, I feel that's pretty much what you do to learn improvisation.

Then there are certain little 2 chord chord progressions, like if you want to make a piratey goofy theme or something like Warcraft 2, starting on C you use Cm [C minor scale] D [D harmonic scale or whatever that one is...the one that goes D, Eb, F#, G, etc...]...

Try paying attention to moving around by intervals, kind of like that whole circle of perfect 5ths thing or whatever that is.

Then there's just learning where to be and when and what to hit and when, and that just comes with playing up and down the scales.

I think improvisation is kind of like...finding your own way to run around scales. It's really neat, because you can create your very own style of doing things that's unique to you.

You could also combine that with learning perfect or relative pitch. With perfect pitch, you'll know where you are and when, and with relative pitch you'll know where to go and when. Yes, perfect pitch is learnable, it just takes a lot of disciplined training...just like anything else I think...

You might try singing scales. I actually have a style that's like...a combination of singing + relative pitch + piano. Singing the melody is easy, but you could practice singing the root tone. I mean, like, if the song goes Cm, G, Cm, Fm, you'd be singing the notes C, G, C, F, regardless of what the bass is playing. In this kind of style of making music/learning path, if you can sing it you can make it.

I also have a lot of substitutes for the dominant I like to use. If the key is in C major or C minor, I might use Dm6/G, (which is actually G9) Ddim7/G, G7+, Fmaj7/G followed by Gmaj, or random-black-notes/F# followed by Gmaj.

Why the weird chord names? These are G9, G7(b9), G7(#5) (or G+7), and G13sus, respectively. Also, why are you using a Maj7 on the dominant in a minor key? If you're not modulating, that is.

I have a proposition. How about we record ourselves improvising and others try and decipher the techniques they use most often. I think this could lead to better discussion, especially when we can hear for ourselves where the other person is going musically. I know there are lots of folks around that can record. Besides, laptops mics are pretty good these days. :)

Also, why are you using a Maj7 on the dominant in a minor key? If you're not modulating, that is.

Why the weird chord names? These are G9, G7(b9), G7(#5) (or G+7), and G13sus, respectively. Also, why are you using a Maj7 on the dominant in a minor key? If you're not modulating, that is.

I suppose the chords sound better that way. But where did I say I was using a Maj7 on the dominant?

I have a proposition. How about we record ourselves improvising and others try and decipher the techniques they use most often. I think this could lead to better discussion, especially when we can hear for ourselves where the other person is going musically. I know there are lots of folks around that can record. Besides, laptops mics are pretty good these days.

Yes. That sounds like fun. I will do it later at home.

Everybody post your improvisations.

If you can improvise, I mean.

improv1.mp3

why i didn't grow as a pianist and was a show off'er guitarist..

so forgive my many mistakes on the piano, jitters etc, but i'm sure you'll find some cool developments and lots of ideas(maybe)?

0:00-2:45 moody searches...

2:48-5:20 some groovin with more funny(?) mistakes

5:20-6:14 moody searches but with groove and many more mistakes.

7:00-end combination of the moods with the groove part, maybe a summery with cheesy sweet ending.

ian,

i think you've got some good chops, but don't stray too much on a scale if you feel the need to break free, just break it, combining the harmonies of all the scales is tough but really worth it, that's when you see the relations between the scales and their substitutes.

impro piano2.mp3

But where did I say I was using a Maj7 on the dominant?

In the first post, you said that if the key was Cm, you'd play some selected chords, followed by a GMaj7. I'm not saying it's "wrong" or anything, just asking why you'd go to that one. Where do you usually go from there?

In the first post, you said that if the key was Cm, you'd play some selected chords, followed by a GMaj7. I'm not saying it's "wrong" or anything, just asking why you'd go to that one. Where do you usually go from there?

I said Gmaj, not Gmaj7.

Although I did say I would use a Fmaj7/G in the key of C minor. That was my bad. I only use Fmaj7/G in C major.

I said Gmaj, not Gmaj7.

Oh, okay. Thanks to varieties of chord symbols used in leadsheets, whenever I see "GMaj" without a "7" written I just naturally think it's a Maj7.

To perhaps bring this thread back to life, here's something I did tonight. I wasn't in a good mood, and I didn't know why, so I decided to just get it out my system and to hell with it. Using a look of 9-8 suspensions in successions and a descending bass at all times. Just felt like falling to the pits of hell... accidentally based it on marche funebre, so I went with that. It's a rant more than anything.

Offer thoughts, analyses, etc, if you can bear to listen to this tonal crap.

http://www.box.net/shared/uobkoklfh7