Choral Competition [DEADLINE PASSED!] View Submissions Thread

[cmajchord]

Speak for yourself. I dont care what anyone says, you dont have to believe me (I probly wouldnt). But when it comes down to it, I CAN sing 4 Cs. I know a girl that has a 4 and a half octave range (low Eb to high high A). Its really amazing to see her scale up 4 and a half octaves, and she does it flawlessly.

*coughcoughbullshitcough*

I'd love a recording of such wonderful singing technique. From high school students, nonetheless. :thumbsup:

[pianoman216]

I really do not appreciate your slander. I said you dont have to believe me, but to tell ME that I'm making it all up? Its a good thing there are so many people on this site that are kind and respectful, if it wasnt for them I would never come back here. I hope you realize that you have degraded the entire site in my eyes, just becuase of your rude and inconsiderate comments. And I CAN hit 4 octaves weather you think its possible or not.

[cmajchord]

OK, you're right. I'm sorry.

[pianoman216]

Thank you. That really helps, you've got my respect back. Now can we go on composing? :thumbsup:

[J. Lee Graham]

I like all of Nick's suggestions, too...but I tend to be most creative when most constrained.

Nick, why are you figuring that the composer with the most accessible style will probably win the competition?

[Tyler Menzel]

I am entering in the race. I have a few choral compositions under my belt. Sign me up. When is the deadline? I want to get started right away. Thanks.

[pianoman216]

Wow, thats amazing how fast this forum bounces baack from arguments :thumbsup:

Anyway, tyler, as far as deadlines go: you need to be signed up by the 30th of this month (which you've just done, so no worries there), the deadline to have our pieces completed and submitted is not yet set.

[Guest Brandon Homayouni]

Usually in choral writing using a low E-flat is borderline distasteful, but a low C?!?!?!?! It would sound so nasty, and I don't think I have ever heard someone hit that note, let alone in a fine musical way.

These are the more comfortable ranges of choral singers:

Soprano: C (middle) -- A (above treble staff); occasionally B-flat

Alto: G (below treble staff) -- C (on treble staff); occasionally D-flat

Tenor: C (on bass staff) -- A (on treble staff); occasionally B-flat

Bass: F (below bass staff) -- D (above middle C); occasionally E-flat

Note, I personally would never take my tenors below an E, but that is personal taste. For altos, I am considering MALE alto ranges. From the ones I have written for, they have always told me they don't want to go above D-flat, but I have spoken to some female altos who say they often have to sing E's in a hard piece. I don't know why people are always trying to stretch the boundaries when they have a nearly infinite palate available to them within which no one would have to strain.

[pianoman216]

The issue wasnt about what you should wirte, it was whats possible to hit. Cs are possible to hit (and sound good when used right, I've seen a song performed with a low C in it), but usually they are not very tasteful.

[Guest Brandon Homayouni]

...but I tend to be most creative when most constrained.

I am totally the same way.

[pianoman216]

I tend to write well when I'm nice and relaxed, but when I'm under pressure it pops out (for lack of a better word) a lot faster.

[Dante]

Brass choir is my forte and I've never written for voice before, but I'd love to join in on the competition, if I may!

[johannhowitzer]

I'm sure you'd be quite welcome.

I'd really love to see this site try to adopt the convention for distinguishing between notes with the same pitch class. "C4" is middle C, "A0" is the lowest note on the piano, and "C7" is the highest note on the piano. Each C begins a new number. We don't need to make this a regulation or anything, but it would reduce confusion if the core members (at least) could adopt this method of communication. Nick, I think you were talking about C3, whereas the other fellas seemed to mean C2. I can't hit C2 even on a good day, and I'm a bass/baritone with a pretty wide range. Eb2 is weak for me, but I can usually hit it.

Sign me up, but I won't be writing anything until at least Sunday - I'm still in New York. It'll be great to be back... for one thing, Kelly's coming to visit on Labor Day weekend! :evil:

[littlechopin]

I would like to enter this competition. may I enter it?

[Nightingale Incorporated]

Just for the record, I have seen Notes written as Low as Bb below the staff and Ab above middle C for basses. A good baritone should be able to sing up to Ab and sometimes Bb. Thomas Hampson has a high C and he's used it! I am not against writing for low basses, because there are some who can do it very well. Vaughan Williams would write his basses down to low D's on occasion, and Mozart would often write down to Low Eb. I happen to know some basses that can sing to a Low C and it sounds great.

However, a voice that can sing from C below the staff to High C above Middle C is impossible. I have to tell you that Falsetto does NOT count in vocal ranges. If it does, then I can sing from F2-F5 with no problems whatsoever. But seeing as nearly half of that is in falsetto, it doesn't really count. It doesn't mean you can't write music to be sun in Falsetto, but you have to do it tastefully.

Regarding Judging types of issues: Arrangements must be done tastefully, and I would expect anyone who does an arrangement to submit new works as well. What we're looking for is original music to show that you can express through music a specific text. I think it's important to have text involved, but it is just as possible to do so well with the use of nonsense languages or syllables. But it MUST be done tastefully.

I think singability is extremely important. Why would you ever write a piece that cannot be performed? When you're writing for a voice, you're writing for an extremely precise instrument that can either be extremely flexible or sometimes not flexible at all. Assume you're writing for an advanced performer, but not impossible.

I think writing A Capella is a tool that can be used for effect, but should, by no means, be encouraged over accompaniment. Accompaniment can in many ways strengthen the vocal line instead of covering it entirely. It is also a tool to be used. Use your better judgement and try to use enough. I don't particularly care if it is accompanied by Piano, Guitar, Harp, Strings, Brass, Orchestra, or otherwise. I've sung with all of these ensembles, and I have yet to be overshadowed by any of them.

If there are any other questions, I'll be glad to offer my opinions. If I am to be a judge, I will be picking out the pieces that most impressed me based on use of text (if any) use of accompaniment (if any) emotion and color and expression. I should know what you think of a song by listening to it.

[Guest Nickthoven]

Ok, it's all settled. I got pms back from most of you, and you all seem to have the same thing in mind. So I have changed the rules:

LIMITATIONS: The overall work should be between 2 - 15 minutes in duration. The work may be accompanied by any ensemble of instruments, but the focus in judging will be on how well the composer works with the voice as an instrument.

TEXT: The composer must credit their text and its author. Any text will do.

DEADLINES: The deadline to sign-up to be a contestant in this competition is WEDNESDAY, AUGUST 30, 2006.

WHAT A COMPLETED ENTRY WILL BE: A full-length composition for any combination of singers, from solo to large, divisi chorus, with or without accompaniment. The text will be clearly notated, and credited to its author. Any program notes will be included in a seperate pdf or text file. The title will be clearly marked, and the name of the composer will be as well. An audio file will include the entire contents of the piece, as it would be if performed live. Sound quality will not be judged upon, but the sounds must be clear if to be judged fairly. Any misrepresentation of the piece in the audio file will be automatically deemed the composer's fault, unless a disclaimer is clearly marked. The work is to be made intended for publication and performance. Also, a form stating the composer's intent with how to deal with the text, and how he used the music to express the text, should be included if the composer wants to explain or comment on something in the music.

ADDITIONS: Some new rules have been implemented: Any form of accompaniment may be used, but the focus of the competition is still on the setting of text for vocalists. The focus is on setting the text to music, so any text may be used. Also, the composer should include a description of his music.

[Guest Anders]

These rules are fine, i'm still in. But say, are we allowed to include fun stuff? like screaming? :evil:

[Guest Brandon Homayouni]

Just for the record, I have seen Notes written as Low as Bb below the staff and Ab above middle C for basses. A good baritone should be able to sing up to Ab and sometimes Bb. Thomas Hampson has a high C and he's used it!

It's not that unheard-of for an opera soloist to reach these outstanding extremities, but a chorus part?! No one would sing it. I have sang in selective choruses where the basses (I am a bass) had to sing a low E-flat and not one singer could manage it.

[Christopher Dunn-Rankin]

In a cappella groups, which arrange pop music for solely vocal performance, it's normal to have at least one bass who can sing a strong Bb1. The group that I'm writing an arrangement for at the moment has 3.

For choral music, I would suggest not having more than one or two basses sing a note that low. Because of its range, it will cut through everything fine, and having more than one or two sing it will cause tuning problems. Same with high tenor ranges.

And about the 4-octave soprano - it's definitely possible. A girl named Alexandra Becerra at my college can sing, either stepped or in gliss, from an Ab2 to an A6, and can do whistle-range notes higher than that. Her highest to date is an Eb7, but not on a long duration.

[Tumababa]

I'm a tenor and I can hit the E below the bass clef. It sounds awful but I can manage it. Some basses in my choir could get as low as the A below the low C below the bass clef.

And don't forget Rachmaninoff's vespers!!!! He wrote for the Bflat below the bass clef. F*****g gorgeous s***e!

[Guest Brandon Homayouni]

These rules are fine, i'm still in. But say, are we allowed to include fun stuff? like screaming? :)

Choral Death Metal? :)

[Guest Brandon Homayouni]

Rachmaninoff's vespers!!!! He wrote for the Bflat below the bass clef[/b]

:vomit:

[leightwing]

Just Curious. - I have participated heavily in this thread, initiating conversations that seem to have had an impact on its format, the use of text, issues of vocal range, etc. But I'm not sure I understand why I have not been included in the judging after asking a number of times. Nicholas, could it be that you are sticking to your guns?:

Frankly, if one cannot see the value of choral music that doesn't have text, they obviously are not fully qualified to judge.

Frankly, I found this comment to be an attack on my character, or condescending at best, and my point of view was not even considered at face value - until later, apparently. I decided to defend my statement in as polite a fashion as I could muster. In the course of my correspondences, I made it clear that I am not AGAINST music not set to text. I did not receive much in the way of acknowledgement of my point of view, except from one or two individuals, one privately, and I intend to respect their privacy.

Nevertheless, all of a sudden, the rules changed in a way that has reflected my point of view. I definitely get the feeling that there was a bit of PMing going on that caused this. Though I have no formal right to complain about it, I am disappointed that I was not consulted on the issue, and a bit confused as to why I haven't been added to the list of judges.

I'm sorry if it seems like I'm complaining - I guess I have been made to feel like an outsider with this particular endeavor (although I could be imagining it), and for all of my efforts to participate - it has been a more than a little frustrating at times.

[Guest Anders]

Choral Death Metal? :)

:) why not?

Another question, I had an idea for some kind of choral symphony for SATB + 2x pianos. Is it okay to use 2 pianos as long as I aknowledge that it is the choral writing i'm being jduged on? (I'd imagine so, but I just need to be completely sure)

[The Baroque Enthusiast]

Count me in for this one!