Sarabande in C# minor

I was just listening to some of the dances I've composed when I realized that I don't yet have a Sarabande written so I decided to write one!  I wrote this in basically like two days on paper.  A Sarabande is a slow dance originating in Spain.  It's usually in binary or variations form, without any pick-ups, in 3/4 or 3/2 meter and stresses the 2nd beat.  I hope you enjoy this one as I had fun writing it!  I've been told it modulates somewhat unexpectedly sometimes - but I didn't intend to keep it strictly Baroque by any means.  I just wanted to preserve the dance rhythms and write something that could actually be danced to.  Thanks for listening and I'd appreciate any feedback you're willing to give!

Very elegant! It's a lot like when romantic composers dabble in baroque forms, producing very interesting results. I like it. I just wish it had some more diverse dynamics than just mf-f, but perhaps you were planning on adding more later?

Anyway, nice piece! I enjoyed it very much!

5 minutes ago, Theodore Servin said:

Anyway, nice piece! I enjoyed it very much!

Thanks!

5 minutes ago, Theodore Servin said:

I just wish it had some more diverse dynamics than just mf-f, but perhaps you were planning on adding more later?

No - unfortunately I just didn't write any dynamics into this piece besides the obligatory balance of the various voices.  I'm somewhat happy with how the piece turned out even without dynamics.  I think I am used to not necessarily having dynamics in these dances because the dynamic range of various instruments that would usually perform them was either non-existent or miniscule (such as the lute and harpsichord for example).  Although I guess I could have given some of the phrases more meaning by including crescendos or decrescendos.  I know my Gavotte in C does have dynamics and it's much improved thanks to them so I should probably have thought about dynamics when writing this piece.  Anyways - thanks for listening and for your comments!

Really enjoyable! The piece is indeed a good one to dance to! The unexpected modulations did not bother me at all and I think the whole piece flowed really nicely. In my case, instead of variety on the dynamics, I missed  some variety in the rhythm during the second part (like some few bars in which tension was created by an instrument playing consistently in 32nd notes). Really nice and impressive that you composed it so fast! 

11 minutes ago, JorgeDavid said:

Really enjoyable! The piece is indeed a good one to dance to! The unexpected modulations did not bother me at all and I think the whole piece flowed really nicely.

Thank you for your kind comments!

11 minutes ago, JorgeDavid said:

In my case, instead of variety on the dynamics, I missed  some variety in the rhythm during the second part (like some few bars in which tension was created by an instrument playing consistently in 32nd notes).

You're right that Sarabande's being usually so slow, include much more written out ornamentation using 32nd and sometimes even 64th notes but that usually happens in the instrumental versions of the dances that don't try to preserve the dance rhythms and instead use the dance forms to create new pieces for a given instrument that don't sound very dance-like (at least in my experience).

18 minutes ago, JorgeDavid said:

Really nice and impressive that you composed it so fast!

What I didn't mention is that I spent the last 2 weeks searching aimlessly and with a dearth of inspiration for the next thing that I might compose.  I am glad that I have a large variety of different dances to fall back on (there's also plenty of dances one could compose that aren't part of the traditional Baroque Dance Suite such as the Tango or the Equadorian Pasillo ... and then there's the more ancient dances like the pavane, galliarde etc.)  One could also try to modernize the old dances somehow .. ???  Anyways - I'm glad I just found something to compose!

Congratulations! Very nice and pleasant piece. I'm not a pro, hence I can't give you a technical opinion, but for my taste it is a very enjoyable sarabande.

Cheers.

Hi, Peter. I like your Sarabande. The surprising modulations are cool. At times the bass moves parallel to the melody which obscures its independence imo. I took a closer look at the theme and reduced it to see more clearly the voice directions and came up with two alternatives. I wonder what you think,maybe the parallel motion was on purpose to help give the music that character of shifting register and modulation?

17 hours ago, Papageno said:

I wonder what you think,maybe the parallel motion was on purpose to help give the music that character of shifting register and modulation?

No I didn't intend there to be parallels (I assume you mean the parallel 5th's?) - I didn't notice that when I was composing/listening to it.  Later on there are some parallel octaves between 1st violins and violas in measure 9 and 10 which I think still sounds fine (that I did intend).  I think parallel 5th's aren't as serious an infraction though especially since it happens so momentarily.  Actually there's parallels scattered all over the piece now that I'm taking a look at it more critically LoL.  In measure 4 beat 2 there's hidden parallel octaves between the 1st violins and violas.  I definitely didn't intend the piece to be a perfect specimen of counterpoint - I'm not even sure if I'm deliberately making it Baroque - I just wanted to write something that is in the character of a Sarabande and could actually be danced to although my harmonic language does still seem like it leans heavily on the Baroque era.

I think both your alternatives are pretty good as far as avoiding those parallels goes - have you ever written for string orchestra?  Measures 13 and 14 would still have parallel octaves between the bass and the 2nd violin part and measures 21 and 22 would have parallels with the 2nd violin and viola part - still only momentary though.  If you want to play around with it some more - be my guest!  I try to not second guess myself too much though although it's possible that there could be a more "perfect" version of it possible to be found if I decided to revise it.  I think for me it's important during the process of composition to put the "rules" in their place and just compose with an abundance of inspiration.  Anyways - thanks for your time and I hope you compose some other Baroque dances besides the minuet!

Great work! I love baroque dances and suites, when they are treated in the baroque way, but also when it is seen from a contemporary prism. 

Sarabande in Spanish is Zarabanda. I did some research because I wanted to write a Spanish Baroque Suite, and apart from popular dances taken by the great composers, there are many others (Zorongo, Fandango, etc...).

Your piece seems to go a bit quick but I think it's OK. Regarding dynamics, I also think it's right, because in the baroque crescendo and diminuendo were not invented yet. I haven't analyzed it exhaustively but if there are parallels, they don't bother at all. In fact, the first part seems to use heterophony  ("a type of texture characterized by the simultaneous variation of a single melodic line. Such a texture can be regarded as a kind of complex monophony in which there is only one basic melody, but realized at the same time in multiple voices, each of which plays the melody differently, either in a different rhythm or tempo, or with various embellishments and elaborations". In this context, even the bass and the upper voice can be seen as doubling voices.

The most famous Zarabanda in those times was the Spanish Folia..., with a fixed harmonic pattern. This has been used even in the 20th century (Rachmaninov, Ligeti).

Greetings.

Luis.

I check this out first because it is in C# minor, my favourite key. (Is that a silly reason?)

I love this dancing little piece! So elegantly made and easily recognizable as a Sarabande. The motion between upper and lower instruments is well maintained. I especially like those contrary motions, as it provides varied sound!

I would love to have some terraced dynamics for this piece! Just the contrast of p and f will be perfect!

I see there are some issue on parallel octaves and fifths. I think it is not as serious as in a four part piece. With one additional voice added the parallel octaves can be more freely allowed if it is occasionally used. Also as this is a dance piece, the style tended not be that as learned as the fugal pieces. Hence the voices need not to be that strict. And as it is only used for a short moment, it will be fine!

I think the rhythm can vary just a little bit for the cello and double bass. I will just make the rhythm of the basses different to move the pace forward in the second beat, instead of stopping at the same beat with the upper instruments. This make the piece even lighter!

How come you write this piece in such a short time!! Please, vouchsafe some muses or inspirations to me to compose faster!!!!

Henry

18 hours ago, Henry Ng said:

How come you write this piece in such a short time!! Please, vouchsafe some muses or inspirations to me to compose faster!!!!

LoL I didn't feel like I was composing the piece at breakneck speed or anything, and it is a relatively short piece that didn't require much discrimination.  I think I also am not distracted by sound and listening to my music as I'm writing it so it cuts down on listening time and I can just focus on writing (since I write on paper but that can also have its drawbacks).

18 hours ago, Henry Ng said:

I think the rhythm can vary just a little bit for the cello and double bass. I will just make the rhythm of the basses different to move the pace forward in the second beat, instead of stopping at the same beat with the upper instruments. This make the piece even lighter!

I wanted to keep the 2nd (or 3rd) beat of each bar heavier and stressed because the style of the Sarabande dance is to stress one or both of those beats and I did that through trying to linger the rhythm on those beats a little bit by using longer note values (and double dotted rhythms).

18 hours ago, Henry Ng said:

I would love to have some terraced dynamics for this piece! Just the contrast of p and f will be perfect!

You're right.  Maybe if there were more sections to the piece, like if I returned to the A material after the B (like AA BB AA) then I could have used different dynamics for each repetition of each section.

18 hours ago, Henry Ng said:

I love this dancing little piece! So elegantly made and easily recognizable as a Sarabande. The motion between upper and lower instruments is well maintained. I especially like those contrary motions, as it provides varied sound!

Thank you for the compliment and for your review!  I love your almost manic (dare I say! LoL) level of activity with which you review pieces on here! 😁

59 minutes ago, PeterthePapercomPoser said:

I wanted to keep the 2nd (or 3rd) beat of each bar heavier and stressed because the style of the Sarabande dance is to stress one or both of those beats and I did that through trying to linger the rhythm on those beats a little bit by using longer note values (and double dotted rhythms).

I see! That's also a good choice.

1 hour ago, PeterthePapercomPoser said:

LoL I didn't feel like I was composing the piece at breakneck speed or anything, and it is a relatively short piece that didn't require much discrimination.  I think I also am not distracted by sound and listening to my music as I'm writing it so it cuts down on listening time and I can just focus on writing (since I write on paper but that can also have its drawbacks)

For me a 2 minute piece will cost me a week, lol! It's always hard for me not to overthink it. I mainly use software to compose but also use notebook to jot down inspirations and ideas. Using notebook definitely pushes my progress a little bit faster.

1 hour ago, PeterthePapercomPoser said:

Thank you for the compliment and for your review!  I love your almost manic (dare I say! LoL) level of activity with which you review pieces on here! 😁

I reviewed this during midway of composing, after finishing an exhausting but quite miraculous passage. It really helps my mind to rest!

I really wish my activity is maniac earlier. I was lucky enough to discover this amazing forum though, since I really learn so much by reviewing pieces! And I think every posts here should be reviewed, since they are products through diligence and composers always want to have others' thoughts, no matter good or bad. (Also I am paid as a reviewer, lol!)

Henry

22 hours ago, Henry Ng said:

(Is that a silly reason?)

I don't know, I am lately pretty attracted to that key in particular too, lol.

Well there's not much more to add that other guys didn't. As @JorgeDavid said, it flows. Despite being in C# minor, it sounds full of joy, the occasional stress on the minor chords (which at first glance I'd say is less common than the use of E major) adds intensity but not melancholy, darkness, nor anything similar. It sounds noble, and I particularly didn't feel issues regarding parallelism perhaps due to the brief time the piece lasts. I agree with Henry on what he said about dynamics, but as you say, possibly more sections would have dissipated this "issue".

Overall, a powerful and noble score.

Kind regards!!

25 minutes ago, Omicronrg9 said:

I don't know, I am lately pretty attracted to that key in particular too, lol.

Well there's not much more to add that other guys didn't. As @JorgeDavid said, it flows. Despite being in C# minor, it sounds full of joy, the occasional stress on the minor chords (which at first glance I'd say is less common than the use of E major) adds intensity but not melancholy, darkness, nor anything similar. It sounds noble,

I love C# minor because Beethoven's op.131 is in the same key. Beethoven is famous for his c minor works, and I remember in a book an author said that C# minor is a "transcendental version of C minor, nobler and transfigured". I love to have minor keys for dances since as you said, it adds intensity and vivacity in a folkore way.

33 minutes ago, Omicronrg9 said:

It sounds noble, and I particularly didn't feel issues regarding parallelism perhaps due to the brief time the piece lasts. I agree with Henry on what he said about dynamics, but as you say, possibly more sections would have dissipated this "issue".

Agree!

Btw, I misread Peter's comment 

5 hours ago, PeterthePapercomPoser said:

almost manic

I see it maniac, lol! But either manic or maniac will fit for me!

Henry

10 minutes ago, Henry Ng said:

Btw, I misread Peter's comment

I see it maniac, lol! But either manic or maniac will fit for me!

A maniac is called that because they are manic, or can be said to have mania, which usually alternates with states of depression after one or more weeks of mania (in bipolar disorder).  I just hope you don't ever have this slump!  You are a very active member as evidenced by this:  (and I hope you continue to be so enthusiastic)

Even at the height of my posting activity, I only ever reached about 30 reputation points per month!  And I thought that was a high number!  LoL

23 minutes ago, PeterthePapercomPoser said:

I just hope you don't ever have this slump!  You are a very active member as evidenced by this:  (and I hope you continue to be so enthusiastic)

I hope so too haha! I'll definitely try to keep this.