Ballade in F minor - for the piano

Hello! 

I'm pretty new to the forum and just posted here for the first time yesterday (in the large ensemble section). I thought I might post another piece that I composed last year for the piano: Ballade in F-minor. With most of my pieces, I tend to improvise themes or notate melodies in my head and develop them at the piano. This piece took that method a step further; nearly all of the musical material and the sequence in which it appears came from a single improvisation (obviously, I heavily edited it during and after transcription to paper though). As such, Ballade has a very quasi improvisando feel throughout. This piece, because of how it was composed, was an opportunity for me to sharpen my editing skills. I suppose you all will be the judges of how well I did at that editing.

Constructive feedback would be very much appreciated. There are a few different areas I'd enjoy feedback on, so choose your favorite (or favorites).

1. What was your favorite part of the piece? What made it enjoyable?
2. What did you dislike most about the piece? 
3. In a similar vein, which were your favorite and least favorite themes? Why?
4. How did you feel about the different styles and moods present in each of the themes?
5. How was the engraving? I'm sure that if you followed along with the score you noticed that it got very dense in several places. Were there any unclear markings (e.g., the floating ties at the Adagio tranquillo)? Are there any places where expanding to three staves would make the score more readable? Don’t be afraid to be specific here. 
6. Did anything in the piece feel out of place?
7. How well did the consonance and dissonance throughout the piece balance?
8. Did you feel that the Adagio tranquillo at the end was too big of a transition or a bad ending?
9. Do you have any comments about my compositional technique (things like harmony, transitions, melodic writing, etc.)?
10. How well did I execute the ballade form (use Chopin as a frame of reference)?
11. What did this piece remind you of (could be a composer, piece, image, scene, or something else)?
12. Any overall suggestions for improvement (in this piece and in general throughout my compositions and style)?

I haven't tried to get this performed (yet), so for a recording, I just sightread the score this morning, worked on it for a bit, and then recorded it with my phone. The recording isn't super great, but it will definitely give you a better picture of the piece than Finale MIDI, even if it sounds like this. I'm also attaching the score below, so feel free to follow along.

Thanks for listening to Ballade! I hope that you enjoy it.

10 November 2022: I've attached an edited score along with a recording. I'll leave the previous score (not the recording; it's not letting me have two mp3s), but be aware that "Ballade in F minor Score.pdf" is the edited score version. Also, my preemptive apologies for the poor performance of the coda.

15 hours ago, JWNewton said:

What was your favorite part of the piece? What made it enjoyable?

The fluidity of the music. The thematic development here was nothing short of masterful, with themes reemerging in new textures, rhythms, dynamics, voices. There was never a dull moment. Predictability was perfectly balanced with the unknown.

15 hours ago, JWNewton said:

What did you dislike most about the piece? 

I didn't objectively dislike anything about this piece. What I found myself wishing for, however, was more adventurous harmony. For the most part, we stayed within the chord degrees of any given scale (F minor, C major, etc.), with a notable exception being the "Meno mosso con abbandono" section (fabulous, that). The traditional harmonies you employed were not detrimental to your piece overall, however; it just happened to be what I dislike the most.

15 hours ago, JWNewton said:

In a similar vein, which were your favorite and least favorite themes? Why?

My favorite theme emerged at m. 109. It has a distinct freshness to it, unmuddied by all the bass chords the other themes tended to have. If I were forced to choose a least favorite, I suppose I would say the opening theme because of the aforementioned muddiness. But I still enjoyed the theme.

15 hours ago, JWNewton said:

How was the engraving? I'm sure that if you followed along with the score you noticed that it got very dense in several places. Were there any unclear markings (e.g., the floating ties at the Adagio tranquillo)? Are there any places where expanding to three staves would make the score more readable? Don’t be afraid to be specific here. 

No problems with the engraving here. Although I did notice an expression text ("delicato") sneak above the staff at m. 61. (I am now certain that you are rather fond of expression texts smattered throughout your score.) Perhaps some suggested fingering at m. 57-58 would be helpful. I personally do not think three staves was ever necessary.

Oh, and there is a random "molto" at m. 56 — not sure what it's supposed to be modifying.

15 hours ago, JWNewton said:

Did anything in the piece feel out of place?

Not even a little bit.

15 hours ago, JWNewton said:

How well did the consonance and dissonance throughout the piece balance?

These are, of course, relative terms, and the whole piece was relatively consonant. Still, for the Romantic idiom in which you wrote, much more dissonance would've ruined the idiom; therefore, I would say that the balance you struck worked very well for this piece.

15 hours ago, JWNewton said:

Did you feel that the Adagio tranquillo at the end was too big of a transition or a bad ending?

I thought it was well-placed. No complaints.

15 hours ago, JWNewton said:

Do you have any comments about my compositional technique (things like harmony, transitions, melodic writing, etc.)?

It's obvious you play piano and are very good at it. This has translated over into your compositional abilities for the instrument. The writing here is perfectly idiomatic for piano, quite successfully done in the idiom you chose. Personally, however, I am wary of pieces that are melodically right-hand-heavy (and a reason I have a problem with Chopin). I'd like to see a piece that is a little more balanced in sharing melodic material between the hands.

15 hours ago, JWNewton said:

How well did I execute the ballade form (use Chopin as a frame of reference)?

Once upon a time, I listened to Chopin. And I won't even pretend to know what the ballade form is.

15 hours ago, JWNewton said:

What did this piece remind you of (could be a composer, piece, image, scene, or something else)?

Decidedly Chopin, maybe a touch of Lizst.

15 hours ago, JWNewton said:

Any overall suggestions for improvement (in this piece and in general throughout my compositions and style)?

Leave Romanticism in the 19th century. You have a strong grasp of how music fits together; I encourage you to explore non-tertian harmonies and non-diatonic scales. They may sound terrible at first, but I think, little by little, you'll find how you can incorporate bits of them without compromising the style you're going for.

The important thing is that you write music you like. It may very well be possible that Romanticism is where your composer's heart is and you'll never leave it. That's perfectly fine. My suggestion is still to explore a little, expand your palette, stretch yourself.

That said, this is a beautiful piece of music — one that I think would fit well in the concert pianist's repertoire. Keep up the good work!

Hey there, welcome to the forums!

This is wonderful, and your performance really brought this to life. You're a very talented pianist, so thanks for the live recording. I gave this a few listens, and I'll touch on some of your requested thoughts.

19 hours ago, JWNewton said:

What was your favorite part of the piece? What made it enjoyable?

I would say your overall pacing and your craftsmanship were my favorite parts. You timed your moments of drama and dynamics perfectly, always building up to powerful sections without anything feeling out of place. It never felt boring, and it was really coherent throughout it's entirety.  Theme's were well-developed and executed and all that. 

19 hours ago, JWNewton said:

What did you dislike most about the piece? 

I felt like the texture had a constant heaviness to it, so maybe sprinkling in some spots with less pedal or being in the higher register would have done some justice. Could be the recording I suppose, but it's pretty damn good for a phone recording.

19 hours ago, JWNewton said:

How was the engraving? I'm sure that if you followed along with the score you noticed that it got very dense in several places. Were there any unclear markings (e.g., the floating ties at the Adagio tranquillo)? Are there any places where expanding to three staves would make the score more readable? Don’t be afraid to be specific here. 

Your score is ridiculously clean, it was very easy to read and follow. I always struggle with engraving, so it was nice to learn a bit from reading yours. Floating ties are fine, but not sure if I saw anywhere that would need three staves.

19 hours ago, JWNewton said:

Did you feel that the Adagio tranquillo at the end was too big of a transition or a bad ending?

Loved the ending

19 hours ago, JWNewton said:

What did this piece remind you of (could be a composer, piece, image, scene, or something else)?

Reminded me of Schumann songs, maybe some Rachmaninoff heavier spots too

19 hours ago, JWNewton said:

Any overall suggestions for improvement (in this piece and in general throughout my compositions and style)?

So this is my overall comment. As Tónskáld mentioned, your style is embedded in the romantic period (just going off of this, not sure of your other pieces). If that's your passion with music, then by all means keep exploring it's possibilities. But if I were you, absorb ideas and inspiration from some of the composers and styles of music that existed past that realm to further help you grow.

I love what you're doing, I love the drama and passionate music of this piece, and it's one that I'll come back to. But explore jazz, or ragtime, or edm, or rock, or Debussy, etc. etc. to continue to build your own unique voice that separates you from the rest. You're obviously a gifted composer and great performer, so give the audience a reason to listen to you rather than Schubert and Chopin. You can keep your romantic bedrock while also peppering in some chord changes found in later eras, or maybe explore later forms with a romantic twist. I'm not saying you should join a bluegrass band, but just keep an open ear out for the other styles to amalgamate into your own voice. 

Like I said before, I'm a fan of your music! Wonderful performance here, and definitely don't be shy around here. There's loads of great musicians on this site that if you gave a few thoughts on their music they almost surely would return the favor.  I'm really happy to have come across your music, and even more excited to hear how your sound continues to evolve and what you have in store for us next.

4 hours ago, Tónskáld said:

The fluidity of the music. The thematic development here was nothing short of masterful, with themes reemerging in new textures, rhythms, dynamics, voices. There was never a dull moment. Predictability was perfectly balanced with the unknown.

Thank you! I think that was my favorite part about this piece being improvised—that the thematic references and unpredictability were completely unintentionally sophisticated. 

4 hours ago, Tónskáld said:

I didn't objectively dislike anything about this piece. What I found myself wishing for, however, was more adventurous harmony. For the most part, we stayed within the chord degrees of any given scale (F minor, C major, etc.), with a notable exception being the "Meno mosso con abbandono" section (fabulous, that). The traditional harmonies you employed were not detrimental to your piece overall, however; it just happened to be what I dislike the most.

One of my self pet-peeves is my obsession with making the harmony of my music smooth and "sounding good" when the chord progression itself looks less than comfortable. For instance (forgive the poor figured bass formatting), the opening chord progression (m. 1-3) is ii ø4/3 - i 6/4- iv m7, which would probably have given my theory teacher nightmares. Yet, it doesn't sound particularly contemporary, at least to my ear. My very favorite period is post-romantic (1890-ish to 1930-ish), and despite that, my music ends up sounding like it's from the heart of the romantic period with the occasional Baroque prelude. In Cantus, too, there are some really odd harmonies, but they don't sound out of place one bit. It feels really weird to ask "How can I make my music sound uglier?" but that's almost what I want to do. I'd love to be able to compose in the post-romantic style (not sure about later stuff like only quartal harmony and whatnot), but for some reason...just am not able. I won't say I'm a huge fan of the contemporary period; I personally think atonality for the sake of atonality and edginess is an abomination, but that doesn't mean I can't enjoy places where consonance and emotion give way to brief moments of quartal harmony and polytonality. That's my favorite part about post-romanticism, actually—that the greater contrast makes the music more romantic. 

4 hours ago, Tónskáld said:

My favorite theme emerged at m. 109. It has a distinct freshness to it, unmuddied by all the bass chords the other themes tended to have. If I were forced to choose a least favorite, I suppose I would say the opening theme because of the aforementioned muddiness. But I still enjoyed the theme.

Interesting. m. 109 to the tempo primo is actually my least favorite theme. I love it, for sure, but not as much as the other themes. It's certainly necessary in the piece to provide relief from the muddiness and emotion and complexity of the rest, as you said. It's my favorite theme for its simplicity and freshness, but not for its musicality. Incidentally, my favorite theme is the first meno mosso (mostly just the first four bars), followed closely by the third meno mosso. 

5 hours ago, Tónskáld said:

No problems with the engraving here. Although I did notice an expression text ("delicato") sneak above the staff at m. 61. (I am now certain that you are rather fond of expression texts smattered throughout your score.) Perhaps some suggested fingering at m. 57-58 would be helpful. I personally do not think three staves was ever necessary.

Oh, and there is a random "molto" at m. 56 — not sure what it's supposed to be modifying.

You are right about the expression texts. There's a story behind this one, actually. Around the time I improvised Ballade, I was learning Albéniz's Fête-Dieu à Seville (fantastic piece; I highly recommend listening if you haven't heard it). Anyway, in the score, you wouldn't believe how meticulous Albéniz's markings were. Dynamics ranged from ppppp to fffff (I'm not even joking) with five expressive texts every measure and footnotes galore, etc., etc. I think Albéniz went over the top (the music is absolutely fantastic though) with those markings; but, one thing I noticed was that every single one of them helped me to hone my interpretation of the piece. So, ever since, I've used more expressive texts in my music. 

(Fun fact: the Adagio tranquillo is a semi-deliberate pastiche of the end of Fête-Dieu, and I'm sure there are other references to it [besides the dense score] that I haven't noticed.)

Here's a link to Fête-Dieu in case you'd like a listen.

Thanks for the engraving comments. That delicato is an easy fix, and I can add some fingering. About the molto, it's supposed to indicate that the crescendo becomes molto crescendo. Is there a way to make that clearer?

5 hours ago, Tónskáld said:

I'd like to see a piece that is a little more balanced in sharing melodic material between the hands.

Good to know. 

5 hours ago, Tónskáld said:

Leave Romanticism in the 19th century. You have a strong grasp of how music fits together; I encourage you to explore non-tertian harmonies and non-diatonic scales. They may sound terrible at first, but I think, little by little, you'll find how you can incorporate bits of them without compromising the style you're going for.

The important thing is that you write music you like. It may very well be possible that Romanticism is where your composer's heart is and you'll never leave it. That's perfectly fine. My suggestion is still to explore a little, expand your palette, stretch yourself.

I already kind of touched on this. Do you have any tips on how to explore writing good less-Romantic music? I will clarify right now that Romanticism is the domain of my composer's heart and I don't mind that, but I certainly would appreciate knowing how to compose more than Baroque and Romantic music, or at least add contemporary elements to my Romantic music.

Thanks so much for your thorough and well-thought-out review! It has helped me very much 🙂 

1 hour ago, Thatguy v2.0 said:

I would say your overall pacing and your craftsmanship were my favorite parts. You timed your moments of drama and dynamics perfectly, always building up to powerful sections without anything feeling out of place. It never felt boring, and it was really coherent throughout it's entirety.  Theme's were well-developed and executed and all that. 

I'm really glad! Form is usually my struggle, so to hear that it was the highlight of Ballade means a lot.

1 hour ago, Thatguy v2.0 said:

I felt like the texture had a constant heaviness to it, so maybe sprinkling in some spots with less pedal or being in the higher register would have done some justice. Could be the recording I suppose, but it's pretty damn good for a phone recording.

I think it's not so much the recording or the register as it is how much pedal I used in the recording. If I spend a good couple of months working on it and then perform it, my interpretation will have much, much less pedal. Did you see the comic I linked? Don't shoot the pianist is a favorite comic relief of mine. Again, the playing in the recording could be better.

1 hour ago, Thatguy v2.0 said:

Your score is ridiculously clean, it was very easy to read and follow. I always struggle with engraving, so it was nice to learn a bit from reading yours. Floating ties are fine, but not sure if I saw anywhere that would need three staves.

Thank you! 

1 hour ago, Thatguy v2.0 said:

Loved the ending

I'm glad.

1 hour ago, Thatguy v2.0 said:

So this is my overall comment. As Tónskáld mentioned, your style is embedded in the romantic period (just going off of this, not sure of your other pieces). If that's your passion with music, then by all means keep exploring it's possibilities. But if I were you, absorb ideas and inspiration from some of the composers and styles of music that existed past that realm to further help you grow.

I love what you're doing, I love the drama and passionate music of this piece, and it's one that I'll come back to. But explore jazz, or ragtime, or edm, or rock, or Debussy, etc. etc. to continue to build your own unique voice that separates you from the rest. You're obviously a gifted composer and great performer, so give the audience a reason to listen to you rather than Schubert and Chopin. You can keep your romantic bedrock while also peppering in some chord changes found in later eras, or maybe explore later forms with a romantic twist. I'm not saying you should join a bluegrass band, but just keep an open ear out for the other styles to amalgamate into your own voice. 

Like I said before, I'm a fan of your music! Wonderful performance here, and definitely don't be shy around here. There's loads of great musicians on this site that if you gave a few thoughts on their music they almost surely would return the favor.  I'm really happy to have come across your music, and even more excited to hear how your sound continues to evolve and what you have in store for us next.

I already talked about this a bit in my reply to Tónskáld, so I'll refer you to there for the detailed rundown of my struggles with more contemporary composition. I love all of those styles that you mentioned. I don't really consider myself a classical music elitist (though I will praise classical music above all other music until the day I die) and I listen to plenty of EDM and rock and whatever else (gotta be "culturally adjusted," y'know 😉) My struggle is amalgamating other techniques into my composition. I haven't tried yet, but I'm sure I could write something completely contemporary if I wanted to; but that isn't what I want to do. What I do want is to take those techniques and use them in my romantic composition so that I can have a more balanced and enjoyable style. I haven't listened to any of your pieces yet (I definitely will after posting this), so I'm blind as to your style, but do you have any ideas for that?

I'm hoping to be pretty involved on here, so we'll probably keep interacting. Thanks for your detailed comments, and I'm looking forward to listening to your music and working together in the future!

Hiya heya,

So, I am sure you can hear from what I write, this is in a much different direction. I actually would not listen to this type of music just willy nilly, which makes it really special when it is something I get to hear via a recital I'm attending or giving feedback to a fellow composer.

This entire piece got cooler and cooler up until the ending. That is no slight to the ending, as it is like the sad and depressed conclusion to this emotional piece and fits very well, but I wouldn't say it was as "cool" as the vicious highs some previous parts reached.

There was one sextuplet you wrote as triplets, which is the one engraving thing I thought looked not great in the score.

My favorite part was the tension of the stacking chords one bar at a time in the middle. I do not think the piano is able to give the climax that phrase effectively needs, which is too bad. At least the buildup was cool. The higher parts of the instrument just does not resonate as powerfully as the booming bass chords growing with the pedal on. 

I can definitely see the emotionally painful music of your favorite composers listed in your profile showing through in this music, from the bit I know about those composers. 

Truly a treat to listen to, and I was surprised how fast eleven minutes flew by. There is a guy who played one of my piano pieces who only charged like $100 for a really great quality recording: 

That is just a thing I thought to bring up. Your playing was amazing.

On 7/31/2022 at 10:02 PM, Eickso said:

This entire piece got cooler and cooler up until the ending. That is no slight to the ending, as it is like the sad and depressed conclusion to this emotional piece and fits very well, but I wouldn't say it was as "cool" as the vicious highs some previous parts reached.

Well put. One of my relatives has a master’s degree in music composition (she’s been my main mentor). We’ve talked about this piece before, but she had some ideas about the end. (I asked what everyone thought about the end because I wasn’t quite satisfied.) Anyway, the end was shrunk down a bit, and I think it’s more effective now. 

On 7/31/2022 at 10:02 PM, Eickso said:

My favorite part was the tension of the stacking chords one bar at a time in the middle. I do not think the piano is able to give the climax that phrase effectively needs, which is too bad. At least the buildup was cool. The higher parts of the instrument just does not resonate as powerfully as the booming bass chords growing with the pedal on. 

This is definitely one of my favorite parts too. For a while, I’ve been working on composing a full-length symphony (as opposed to tone poems and the like), and an orchestration of Ballade will likely function as the first movement. And of course, the orchestra would be able to deliver this climax very well. It’s interesting that you point this out though. Before you made this comment, I came to the same conclusion and actually cut this part out. Now, there’s a buildup to a climax that never comes, which makes the subsequent real climax more effective.

On 7/31/2022 at 10:02 PM, Eickso said:

Truly a treat to listen to, and I was surprised how fast eleven minutes flew by. There is a guy who played one of my piano pieces who only charged like $100 for a really great quality recording: 

High compliments! I’m very glad that you enjoyed listening, especially to music that isn’t your preferred style! Thanks for the recommendation; I may perform this myself or show it to other pianist friends, but I figure I’m competent enough a pianist (if I practice, haha) to not need to hire a recording. I’ll definitely check out your Poetic Pieces though! It’s always nice to hear a live recording. 

Thanks for your comments!

Jacob

I love this piece of yours. There's no part I dislike about it. It reminds me of Chopin, perhaps even a bit of Schubert. I don't see any problems with the engraving. I especially like the dynamic shifts and drama that occurs, I love listening to dramatic music more than any other kind of music. I listen to Romantic Era music a lot, especially Chopin. Beethoven as well if you count transitional with pieces in a Romantic Era style. In fact I tend to listen to Beethoven more than any other composer. I only really acquired a taste for Beethoven when I was a teenager and heard his C minor Piano Concerto for the first time, but ever since, he's been my favorite composer. I tend to compose in a Classical/Romantic style myself with some Baroque as well, so I understand where you're coming from in regards to it being hard to not write in a Romantic style.

18 hours ago, JWNewton said:

For a while, I’ve been working on composing a full-length symphony (as opposed to tone poems and the like), and an orchestration of Ballade will likely function as the first movement.

Interesting. I hope to hear your symphony someday. I'm also working on a symphony it turns out. It's been planned out for years and it's finally coming to fruition. As you might expect from me rambling on a bit about Beethoven and how he's my favorite composer, this symphony I'm writing is inspired by Beethoven.

On 7/12/2022 at 1:58 PM, JWNewton said:

What I do want is to take those techniques and use them in my romantic composition so that I can have a more balanced and enjoyable style. I haven't listened to any of your pieces yet (I definitely will after posting this), so I'm blind as to your style, but do you have any ideas for that?

Sorry! Didn't see this, but yes I do! In fact, I recently wrote a piece where this was the goal. Some thoughts:

-Maybe think about your romantic language using forms uncommon or never used during it's heyday. Hell, even a modern verse-chorus-whatever type form could be cool. 

-Think about implementing tonalities (or lack thereof) that weren't used during that era. Jazz harmonies and quartal/quintal structures of chords come to mind. 

-Start with something that's far from romanticism yet more recent, let's say a blues piece. What could you do with that to incorporate what you love from romanticism?

-Think of different timbres. One of the biggest musical innovations over the last few decades hasn't been from a language perspective, but one of timbre. You play the piano ridiculously well. What if you had a percussive organ? Or a synth?

Stick to your guns, but if you try and write like Beethoven, it will never be as good as Beethoven, because he was innovating in HIS time. You just have to pull from what the greats did and apply it in 2022. 

If you've never checked out Frank Zappa, maybe you should. He grew up wanting to be a great composer, but he knew the time he was born in had to deviate from the traditional orchestra if he was to be successful. A lot of his music is far out there, but if nothing else, check out some interviews he's done about music. He was incredibly smart and gifted with words, and someone I learned a lot from. One of my favorite things he said was about his guitar solos, and how he never wanted them to be the same. Every show he did had a truckload of improvisation married alongside his composed sections. It's something I use in my music today. 

That's an ambitious and espressive piece. I really like it.

On 7/12/2022 at 5:58 AM, JWNewton said:

What was your favorite part of the piece? What made it enjoyable?

My favourite part is also the meno mosso con abbandano section. The flow is better and it provides a new perspective for the piece.

On 7/12/2022 at 5:58 AM, JWNewton said:

What did you dislike most about the piece?

Comparatively I don't like the opening. I think the build up to tension is somewhat too long. Up until bar 75 meno mosso, the pacing is somewhat static with metronome like quaver beat. I know that you want to provide a pretext for later outbrust, but I think there can be more variety in the accompaniment during the opening.

Also, there can be more varieties in keys in the opening, instead of keeping in F minor and C major. Personally I find even the opening of Chopin Ballade no.4 not contrasting enough, so this may be my problem.

On 7/12/2022 at 5:58 AM, JWNewton said:

In a similar vein, which were your favorite and least favorite themes? Why?

Similar to above answers.

On 7/12/2022 at 5:58 AM, JWNewton said:

How did you feel about the different styles and moods present in each of the themes?

I love the contrasting styles and moods, and that is effective.

On 7/12/2022 at 5:58 AM, JWNewton said:

How was the engraving? I'm sure that if you followed along with the score you noticed that it got very dense in several places. Were there any unclear markings (e.g., the floating ties at the Adagio tranquillo)? Are there any places where expanding to three staves would make the score more readable? Don’t be afraid to be specific here. 

Your scoring is definitely very readable and clean, not to please you but that's the truth. Yours is definitely better than my scoring.

On 7/12/2022 at 5:58 AM, JWNewton said:

Did anything in the piece feel out of place?

No, except the prolonged build up.

On 7/12/2022 at 5:58 AM, JWNewton said:

How well did the consonance and dissonance throughout the piece balance?

The dissonance in the latter half is impressive. But the first half is too consonant for me. Maybe more dissonance can be added.

On 7/12/2022 at 5:58 AM, JWNewton said:

Did you feel that the Adagio tranquillo at the end was too big of a transition or a bad ending?

I love that ending. It gives me the impression of the ending of Chopin Ballade no.2. Something tranquillo after disasters provide huge amount of contrast. Great job.

On 7/12/2022 at 5:58 AM, JWNewton said:

Do you have any comments about my compositional technique (things like harmony, transitions, melodic writing, etc.)?

I think harmonically you can be more adventuruous. Textuall I think you learn from Rachmaniov's piece, and I think the harmony can match that too. Melodically I think you can melody to low register and left hand for contrast, instead of putting all the melodies to right hand. Some counterpoints can be added to enrich the passages, for example in the molto meastoso con fuoco section, where you did a nice job.

On 7/12/2022 at 5:58 AM, JWNewton said:

How well did I execute the ballade form (use Chopin as a frame of reference)?

You compose the climax really well. I think the pacing of the beginning can be quicker.

On 7/12/2022 at 5:58 AM, JWNewton said:

What did this piece remind you of (could be a composer, piece, image, scene, or something else)?

The texture reminds me of Rach's piece.i

On 7/12/2022 at 5:58 AM, JWNewton said:

Any overall suggestions for improvement (in this piece and in general throughout my compositions and style

The dramatic pacing can be improved, but otherwise you are already a master in it. Just keep composing and you will find your way to improve. Amazing!

First off, I must congratulate you. I can count on my hand the number of pieces that have made me actually cry and this is one of them, I was so moved by the musical journey that you took me on (which I'm sure has some extra-musical inspiration and that really came through in both the writing and your performance). I would not see this out of place among the most beautiful works such as (although they're concertos not solo works) Rach 2 2nd mvt, Shostakovich 2 2nd mvt, Beethoven 5 2nd movement and so on, which as I'm sure you can tell is definitely high praise. I salute you for your work, great job!

So, my thoughts on this piece...

The first theme and the quaver interjections complement each other well, and this fits in a Ballade if you were taking Chopin as your guide.

You build up to the dramatic passage in bar 57 well, although personally I would have extended it to a 4-bar phrase as it's a 'lovely' contrast to the beautiful melodic writing at the beginning. That's just my thoughts though, feel free to disagree.

The new meno mosso material at bar 75 is a nice contrast to what has come before but it still feels like part of the same piece, as is common in a Ballade which in literature is a sort of song-style poem made up of 'verses' and 'choruses'. 

I love your harmonic work throughout the entire piece, the addition of the extended harmonies in the more passionate moments really gives a lot of colour to the work. However, I'm not quite sure about the modulation and key change in bar 88, it doesn't sound like a natural relation even if it is theoretically sound (pun intended), but again just my thoughts. The modulation and key change in bar 124 works really well though.

The marcato section in bar 146 reminds me of the grandioso from Liszt's Piano Sonata, but I think it deserves more development since it's such an impressive and grand moment, personally I think you move on from the material into the triplets too quickly.

The recap of one of the themes (can't remember off the top of my head which number, sorry!) at the meno mosso in bar 157 is a nice addition to separate the ideas, again fitting into the Ballade general structure which I mentioned before. 

My only significant quarm with this piece is at bar 164 with the molto maestoso. It's almost frustrating because to me it sounds like it really wants to go into a furious Chopin-esque coda/cadenza but the writing holds it back and stunts it. Personally I would go straight into a coda/cadenza starting at bar 172, I think that would really put the icing on the cake if you had a monstrous section to rival Chopin's 1st and 4th Ballades after you've build up all the tension. I would urge you to listen to those two works and have a look at how the run up to and the codas/cadenzas themselves work as that is a key part of a typical Chopin Ballade, which it sounds to me like you are aiming to create your own take on.

A small thing, but the gliss in bar 188 wasn't played in the recording- was this intentional?

Ending on an Adagio is an interesting choice and not really consistent with a typical Ballade, although in the case of this piece specifically it actually works quite well. There is also no real definitive way to write a Ballade- for example there are a lot of differences between how Chopin and Bortkiewicz write one.

The gemendissomamente marking at the end is not a common one but I suppose, because it is a very specific effect that you want to achieve, that it is necessary.

Overall I absolutely adored this piece, for me it was very emotionally hard-hitting and the writing for piano was perfectly executed. In fact I love it so much that I would love the chance to play it in a concert, although it might take me a bit of time to learn. Again, congratulations- you have something really special here.

On 11/6/2022 at 12:37 AM, Henry Ng said:

 

Henry,

Thank you so much for your detailed comments! I appreciated the Chopinistic context of your comments. Have you ever listened to York Bowen's ballades, or his other piano music? It's absolutely fantastic. I was also inspired by Bowen's ballades to an extent. If you want to check his music out, Joop Celis has it all recorded. The ballades, Toccata op. 155, and 24 Preludes are great jumping-off points for getting into his music.

Thanks for telling me how you feel about the dramatic pacing. I'll take that into consideration when composing similar music in the future.

Again, thanks for taking the time to write a detailed review!

On 11/6/2022 at 8:34 AM, Charles Geday said:

 

Charles,

Thank you for your kind words and in-depth comments! The second movement of Shostakovich's 2nd concerto is one of my all-time favorites, so for you to say that this piece had a similar impact on you means a great deal.

The marcato in m.146 has actually been edited out (it jumps from m.144 to 157 now), which helps emphasize the Molto maestoso con fuoco more.

Since making the original post, I have composed an alternative ending that I have mixed feelings about. It is more of a "furious Chopin-esque coda" (though I'd call it more Lisztian), but it has less emotional impact. I'll attach the edited score and another sight-reading recording on the original post in case you're interested in hearing that and the other edits I've made. 

The m.188 line is actually not a glissando. I was indicating that the left hand jumps down to the Db octave.

Like with Henry, I really appreciated the Chopin-esque context that you made these comments in. I mentioned York Bowen when replying to him, and I think you would enjoy his music too. It's like Rachmaninoff + Chopin + British + ...something like Gershwin. He's one of the finest post-Romantic composers, in my opinion, and the pianism of his writing is third only to Chopin and Liszt (sometimes even better than Liszt, I think). It's baffling to me that his music is so rarely heard. His ballades were another source of inspiration for this piece. If you want to explore his music, his ballades, Toccata op.155, and 24 Preludes are great pieces to start with.

Thanks again for your thorough comments!

54 minutes ago, JWNewton said:

Charles,

Thank you for your kind words and in-depth comments! The second movement of Shostakovich's 2nd concerto is one of my all-time favorites, so for you to say that this piece had a similar impact on you means a great deal.

The marcato in m.146 has actually been edited out (it jumps from m.144 to 157 now), which helps emphasize the Molto maestoso con fuoco more.

Since making the original post, I have composed an alternative ending that I have mixed feelings about. It is more of a "furious Chopin-esque coda" (though I'd call it more Lisztian), but it has less emotional impact. I'll attach the edited score and another sight-reading recording on the original post in case you're interested in hearing that and the other edits I've made. 

The m.188 line is actually not a glissando. I was indicating that the left hand jumps down to the Db octave.

Like with Henry, I really appreciated the Chopin-esque context that you made these comments in. I mentioned York Bowen when replying to him, and I think you would enjoy his music too. It's like Rachmaninoff + Chopin + British + ...something like Gershwin. He's one of the finest post-Romantic composers, in my opinion, and the pianism of his writing is third only to Chopin and Liszt (sometimes even better than Liszt, I think). It's baffling to me that his music is so rarely heard. His ballades were another source of inspiration for this piece. If you want to explore his music, his ballades, Toccata op.155, and 24 Preludes are great pieces to start with.

Thanks again for your thorough comments!

 

I'd love to see/hear the revised version, of course! Also thanks for the recommendation- I'll be sure to check out Bowen! In fact, I'd like to make a recommendation Rach 1. The cadenza in the first movement is one of my favourite cadenzas of all time, when I listen to the Zimmerman/DG recording I wonder why I even bother playing piano at all lol.