SYMPHONIC SONATAS 1 - 5

I present the first five Symphonic Sonatas - beginning in reverse chronologic order. 

Symphonic Sonata No. 5 in Bb

Hi @Symphonic,

On 4/6/2023 at 11:57 PM, Symphonic said:

I present the first five Symphonic Sonatas - beginning in reverse chronologic order.

What do you mean by "Symphonic Sonata"? The playing here is nice but it's hard to follow for 32 minutes. For me they are many passages of improvisations without connections. And I don't find anything symphonic in it since the colour isn't that varied. I've listened to symphonies played by an organ which has many different types for different orchestral colour so it's perfectly fine to be called a Symphony, but for a piano piece I don't think so. There are many chords, scales, broken chords and arpeggios but I am afraid not many passages are memorable.

Thanks for sharing!

3 hours ago, Henry Ng Tsz Kiu said:

Hi @Symphonic,

What do you mean by "Symphonic Sonata"? The playing here is nice but it's hard to follow for 32 minutes. For me they are many passages of improvisations without connections. And I don't find anything symphonic in it since the colour isn't that varied. I've listened to symphonies played by an organ which has many different types for different orchestral colour so it's perfectly fine to be called a Symphony, but for a piano piece I don't think so. There are many chords, scales, broken chords and arpeggios but I am afraid not many passages are memorable.

Thanks for sharing!

 

Thank you for your detailed response. 

1. "Symphonic sonata" is a genre of my conception. As of now, there is no strict definition except that of the music itself. In other words, what is a symphonic sonata? A symphonic sonata is the 32 minutes of music that you just heard.

Well, it can also be defined as a synthesis between the orchestral symphony and the piano sonata. 

2. What is your "musical connection" of preference? I would like to know. It is likely that I will incorporate that style in future works - should it be suitable. 

3.  I think there are certainly a wealth of symphonic elements within the piece. Though relatedly,  at no point in time have I, or will I, refer to the piece as a Symphony. 

4. In reference to your comment on the passages not being memorable,  I will evaluate the character of the thematic material. Yes memorability is a key aspect of 'good' music.

At the same time, I believe in the journey of the 'moment' and that moment alone. 

Any further questions, I will gladly answer. The more commentary, the better. 

Hi @Symphonic,

Thanks for your reply!

2 hours ago, Symphonic said:

Well, it can also be defined as a synthesis between the orchestral symphony and the piano sonata. 

What do you mean by a synthesis between symphony and piano sonata? The varied timbre of a symphony is not quite featured here for me as a symphonic one. There are different moods here but not symphonic. Symphony for me has different timbre featured as in an orchestra, and to be named sonata the whole music should have means to be linked as whole instead of bunches of different pieces.

2 hours ago, Symphonic said:

As of now, there is no strict definition except that of the music itself. In other words, what is a symphonic sonata? A symphonic sonata is the 32 minutes of music that you just heard.

I don't think the naming works. I can name a piano quartet a "String Quartet" by only using the name's intension too. But not its extension when the name includes communicable meanings. There is indeed no "strict" definition, but not wholly without limitations on using the terms too.

2 hours ago, Symphonic said:

What is your "musical connection" of preference? I would like to know. It is likely that I will incorporate that style in future works - should it be suitable. 

For me musical connection can include melodic, motivic, rhythmic, harmonic connections which make the music linked as a meaningful whole. 

2 hours ago, Symphonic said:

I think there are certainly a wealth of symphonic elements within the piece. Though relatedly,  at no point in time have I, or will I, refer to the piece as a Symphony. 

What passages do you think there is a wealth of symphonic elements? I will listen more attentively there!

2 hours ago, Symphonic said:

At the same time, I believe in the journey of the 'moment' and that moment alone. 

The music to be "in the moment" is crucial. But to have a meaningful whole and cohesion isn't contradictory to the first goal. Mahler has many "moments" too, but he linked them by themes, motives, rhythm, harmony, timbre etc.

2 hours ago, Symphonic said:

Any further questions, I will gladly answer. The more commentary, the better. 

I love this kind of discussion!

Henry

here i hear no striving for effects or a desire to explore musical constructs merely for the excuse of exploring them nor a need to worry whether or not these tones deserve any particular appellation or title and no reason to do anything other than appreciate (enjoy) the logical and artistic flow of this work. Schubert's piano music, which has been described at times as 'boring' is brought to mind. Schubert, that great master, 'boring'? of course not! that was a tongue in cheek complement pointing the lack of flash or showiness in his music and so i apply it here in that sense. yes, 32 minutes is a long time but the impetus and raison d'être that i sense throughout seems all of a piece and holds thing together quite well. the final section beginning around 29 minutes is very effective and to the point. a symphony? nah...most of those do not conclude with wonderfully quiet and subtle tones such those presented here.

On 4/11/2023 at 10:09 AM, Henry Ng Tsz Kiu said:

meaningful whole and cohesion

it is a testament to the validity and variability of musical art that satisfying ends can be reached by 'bombastic' and 'more subtle' and outright 'subtle' means. mahler chose one path, others choose other paths. viva la difference! none should or can remain supreme.

Hi, sir.

On 4/11/2023 at 10:17 AM, Henry Ng Tsz Kiu said:

Symphonic Sonata

I would have thought that since the author's name here is "Symphonic" perhaps it was just referring to a work of his. Just read the comment made in regards of that though, haha.

• Do you have a score of this?

In my honest opinion, I am still in minute 7 but all I'm listening sounds pretty much CONVINCING. You have managed to make a simple small motive entertaining enough to last quite a while, and the way you develop and branch off from that is done quite decently in my opinion. I can tell that at least in my case I will not easily forget this motive.
 

On 4/11/2023 at 1:54 PM, Symphonic said:

A symphonic sonata is the 32 minutes of music that you just heard.

I kinda like this too. 

Minute 15. Sir, you must have a score of this. I really hope you do. I thought I just finished your second part. The third one starts powerfully, but ends in an abrupt pause that I'm not sure whether it convinced me or not. 

The section that continues with a different structural motif doesn't convince me that much. I would say it needs some polishing overall. By 21:30 it has returned tangentially to the backbone motive. By min 29, I'm completely absorbed, wondering why some passages still fit to me even while they consist basically on repetitions of the same chord. You walk dangerously but masterfully in that line between what I'd consider excessive repetition and abundant use of certain stuff. It's impressive how you managed to keep the tension all the way to the end and how you did solve everything. I'm confused, and amazed somehow.

I do encourage you to post more here, seen that you have a quite good amount of music of your craft to show. I would gladly invite you to have a look at other users' posts too, since they probably want to comment their pieces or see others' points of. In any case, congratulations for this, and thanks, since it was really a pleasure to listen to this symphonic sonata.

Kind regards,
Daniel–Ømicrón.




 

I've listened to symphonies played by an organ which has many different types for different orchestral colour so it's perfectly fine to be called a Symphony, but for a piano piece I don't think so. There are many chords, scales, broken chords and arpeggios but I am afraid not many passages are memorable.

pikashow apk

ppsspp gold apk
 

On 4/17/2023 at 5:29 AM, AKAChristopher said:

here i hear no striving for effects or a desire to explore musical constructs merely for the excuse of exploring them nor a need to worry whether or not these tones deserve any particular appellation or title and no reason to do anything other than appreciate (enjoy) the logical and artistic flow of this work. Schubert's piano music, which has been described at times as 'boring' is brought to mind. Schubert, that great master, 'boring'? of course not! that was a tongue in cheek complement pointing the lack of flash or showiness in his music and so i apply it here in that sense. yes, 32 minutes is a long time but the impetus and raison d'être that i sense throughout seems all of a piece and holds thing together quite well. the final section beginning around 29 minutes is very effective and to the point. a symphony? nah...most of those do not conclude with wonderfully quiet and subtle tones such those presented here.

 

Thank you for your kind review.  I have added 'raison d'être' to my vocabulary - a phrase with profound meaning. 

Yes, I value the works of Schubert - especially his innovations with the left hand accompaniment style. 

It is interesting to me that the concept of time seems to be a recurring theme in this comment section. I did not envisage that 32 minutes would be considered a long time for a complete work.  Nevertheless, I am glad that you could still appreciate the journey. 

On 4/20/2023 at 7:40 AM, Omicronrg9 said:

Hi, sir.

I would have thought that since the author's name here is "Symphonic" perhaps it was just referring to a work of his. Just read the comment made in regards of that though, haha.

• Do you have a score of this?

In my honest opinion, I am still in minute 7 but all I'm listening sounds pretty much CONVINCING. You have managed to make a simple small motive entertaining enough to last quite a while, and the way you develop and branch off from that is done quite decently in my opinion. I can tell that at least in my case I will not easily forget this motive.
 

I kinda like this too. 

Minute 15. Sir, you must have a score of this. I really hope you do. I thought I just finished your second part. The third one starts powerfully, but ends in an abrupt pause that I'm not sure whether it convinced me or not. 

The section that continues with a different structural motif doesn't convince me that much. I would say it needs some polishing overall. By 21:30 it has returned tangentially to the backbone motive. By min 29, I'm completely absorbed, wondering why some passages still fit to me even while they consist basically on repetitions of the same chord. You walk dangerously but masterfully in that line between what I'd consider excessive repetition and abundant use of certain stuff. It's impressive how you managed to keep the tension all the way to the end and how you did solve everything. I'm confused, and amazed somehow.

I do encourage you to post more here, seen that you have a quite good amount of music of your craft to show. I would gladly invite you to have a look at other users' posts too, since they probably want to comment their pieces or see others' points of. In any case, congratulations for this, and thanks, since it was really a pleasure to listen to this symphonic sonata.

Kind regards,
Daniel–Ømicrón.




 

 

Hi Daniel–Ømicrón,

You write, and expressive yourself very well. 

I do not yet have a score of this work. Scoring and publication is the next major project. Yes, your phrase 'develop and branch off' is exactly what I am trying to do. That you will not forget the motive is pleasing to me!  Then, it is no longer 'my motive' or the motive of the music, but rather, our motive. 

I have read your feedback a few times to really absorb exactly what you mean. I appreciate your balanced feedback. 

To solve the tension by the end of the work is indeed the ultimate goal. The greater the tension, the greater the challenge.

You are right - I ought to view and engage with the other composer posts on this forum. 

Kind regards,

F. Adebiyi