Lesson with TheMeaningofLife

We're going to be talking about Karl's piece 'the Blackened Pearl', for piano, strings, and brass.

Karl, you have managed to convey pretty much what you set out to - a feeling of melancholy, sadness, and with a slight optimism at the end. However, I think the musical development is lacking. You have a number of motivic elements -

1. The main pulse (played by piano only) : 4/4/4/88/4

2. The main theme (played by everyone but the piano and the highest and lowest strings), which is always 2 measures long

3. The secondary theme(s), which are repeated exactly and with the same instruments

These elements help keep the piece cohesive, and I think that should be enough, because a lot of new music lacks these things, and therefore sounds unfocused. You have these elements to rely on, yes, but I feel you have under developed them, and instead, have repeated them. A two measure phrase is ok, but the only development you have done to it is to switch it between horns and strings, whilst changing keys. I urge you to explore how you might variate the melody as to make it more developed towards the end, and especially try to lengthen the melody. Measure 19 should be a developing point, as it is very unstable in key and that alone usually (in a classical sonata form, at least) signifies a development section. There, I would look at the violins as the main developers, lengthening the melody and perhaps really focusing on one or two small fragments of it (such as the 88/2 /2 idea, with the major 2nd and then the jump up, perhaps changing the direction every other time, or alternating the intervals, instead of d-e-g - d#, something like d#-e-d - g, etc.). I would then have the horns perhaps play in augmentation or diminuition, the original melody, providing a backdrop for the violins. (instead of 88/2 /2 , 4/4/1 /1 , or 16164/ 4 , etc.)

This brings me to another point - the piano. What is its function? Ponder this along with ways to bring it to the foreground a bit more, perhaps letting it have the melody, or perhaps giving it a melodic solo for a newer C section, since you have it waaaay in the background for both your A and B sections?

That brings me to another point - the clear section-ness of this piece. A/B/A/B, B having a sort of binary form, there seems to be a B1 and a B2, although the themes and sounds are pretty similar. This form is very stable and conducive to a cohesive whole, but it uninteresting if they are treated as repeats, and not variated. Which is why I want to ask that you think of adding more variation to both the second A section and the second B section. You lead into the sections well, and you seem to have a great grasp on form, but I feel there needs to be something the different the second time around for both the sections, rather than addition of instruments.

Well, I'll give you credit that you did add certain things to the second A and Bs. The quintuplets for the second A section are a great addition, as is the canonic effect between the horns and violins (although there could certainly be more interplay, make both the questions and the answers more interesting, and different as they go along, maybe gradually lengthen the ideas throughout the section). The general 'beefyness' of the second B section is a great climactic point, as well, although some more harmonic variation in this section would be nice.

Overall, I'd suggest to add rather than subtract. What you have is very nice, and works well, but it's a little safe. For your first task, I'd like to see you take the second A section's melodies between the horns and violins, and lengthen, develop, variate, etc. Just work on that for now, and then post what you get when you feel it works, or if something's not working, etc.

Spread-It.com Webhosting for the score

http://www.youngcomposers.com/forum/hosting-6971.html#post94767 for the midi

SoundClick artist: Karl Nord - Band page with free MP3 music downloads on SoundClick for the mp3

We're going to be talking about Karl's piece 'the Blackened Pearl', for piano, strings, and brass.

Karl, you have managed to convey pretty much what you set out to - a feeling of melancholy, sadness, and with a slight optimism at the end. However, I think the musical development is lacking. You have a number of motivic elements -

1. The main pulse (played by piano only) : 4/4/4/88/4

2. The main theme (played by everyone but the piano and the highest and lowest strings), which is always 2 measures long

3. The secondary theme(s), which are repeated exactly and with the same instruments

These elements help keep the piece cohesive, and I think that should be enough, because a lot of new music lacks these things, and therefore sounds unfocused. You have these elements to rely on, yes, but I feel you have under developed them, and instead, have repeated them. A two measure phrase is ok, but the only development you have done to it is to switch it between horns and strings, whilst changing keys. I urge you to explore how you might variate the melody as to make it more developed towards the end, and especially try to lengthen the melody. Measure 19 should be a developing point, as it is very unstable in key and that alone usually (in a classical sonata form, at least) signifies a development section. There, I would look at the violins as the main developers, lengthening the melody and perhaps really focusing on one or two small fragments of it (such as the 88/2 /2 idea, with the major 2nd and then the jump up, perhaps changing the direction every other time, or alternating the intervals, instead of d-e-g - d#, something like d#-e-d - g, etc.). I would then have the horns perhaps play in augmentation or diminuition, the original melody, providing a backdrop for the violins. (instead of 88/2 /2 , 4/4/1 /1 , or 16164/ 4 , etc.)

This brings me to another point - the piano. What is its function? Ponder this along with ways to bring it to the foreground a bit more, perhaps letting it have the melody, or perhaps giving it a melodic solo for a newer C section, since you have it waaaay in the background for both your A and B sections?

That brings me to another point - the clear section-ness of this piece. A/B/A/B, B having a sort of binary form, there seems to be a B1 and a B2, although the themes and sounds are pretty similar. This form is very stable and conducive to a cohesive whole, but it uninteresting if they are treated as repeats, and not variated. Which is why I want to ask that you think of adding more variation to both the second A section and the second B section. You lead into the sections well, and you seem to have a great grasp on form, but I feel there needs to be something the different the second time around for both the sections, rather than addition of instruments.

Well, I'll give you credit that you did add certain things to the second A and Bs. The quintuplets for the second A section are a great addition, as is the canonic effect between the horns and violins (although there could certainly be more interplay, make both the questions and the answers more interesting, and different as they go along, maybe gradually lengthen the ideas throughout the section). The general 'beefyness' of the second B section is a great climactic point, as well, although some more harmonic variation in this section would be nice.

Overall, I'd suggest to add rather than subtract. What you have is very nice, and works well, but it's a little safe. For your first task, I'd like to see you take the second A section's melodies between the horns and violins, and lengthen, develop, variate, etc. Just work on that for now, and then post what you get when you feel it works, or if something's not working, etc.

Spread-It.com Webhosting for the score

http://www.youngcomposers.com/forum/hosting-6971.html#post94767 for the midi

SoundClick artist: Karl Nord - Band page with free MP3 music downloads on SoundClick for the mp3

Thanks I'll get right on it.

Well there it is. I worked on it for about four hours. I tried on the development section. I tried to diminish it first but that ruined the feel of the song so I augmented it and added in some piercing piano rythms. It didn't turn out exactly how I'd have liked to have it but :D . The second B section I added on too and shook a couple of the rythms around ,a wonderful addition to the piece. I added a bit more piano at the end as well to close it out. All in all I'm alot happier with it. I hope you enjoy it.

I need to work on ways of developing things. Anything you'd highly suggest?

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midi's attached

Go to SoundClick MP3: Karl Nord - Band page with free MP3 music downloads on SoundClick

I will look at this and post back within a couple of days. Nice job, working so quickly! :laugh:

It's not ever my intent to give you undeserved praise. Just thought I'd let you know that:

Wow. You suceeded in what I was trying to have you do. A+ for this assignment. You have lengthened the recap of A about an extra 1/3rd, and you had the sense to, instead of mindlessly develop, actually build in development, and help lead to the next section, the recap of B. I really like the effect this creates, and it makes B sound very new and fresh. I also like how you variated the melody in A, it works very well. The new ending works well, too, especially with the fermatas, although I would think it would be more dramatic putting all but the last held note with the fermata back to regular quarters, and having a ritardando into it, rather than bummmm...pause, bummmmm...pause, bummmmm...pause, bummmmmmmmmm!! But: bum, bumm, bummm, buuummmmmmm!!! Like in an old black and white suspense film or something.

A couple of things to consider, in order to finish this piece up: In your build up, in the recap of A, you variate the horns and the violins very well, building up into the next section, but I don't feel the momentum is gained as well as it could be. I feel that if there were more moving rhythms, perhaps created by the lower strings not really in play at that point (or merely holding notes, such as the bass), perhaps just pulsing one note, in rhythms that were gradually getting faster (4/4/4/4/4, 88/4/4/88/4, 88/4/88/88/4, etc.), momentum and the feeling of build-up would be created more dramtically and in greater amount.

Also, the only real playability issue I have about this piece: A written B for horns is OK, but only if used spraringly in a piece, and definitely not (usually) on a softer dynamic. I would OK the beginning of the piece where you use it, because it is at the end of an expressive melodic phrase, therefore will be stressed, but your ending, putting the 1st horn up there, is semi-problematic. Holding a high B (concert E) up there at a low dynamic, in a thin texture regarding the other insturments accompanying it, is not the best thing for a horn player. I'd suggest giving the 1st the G (and changing the pick-up from A to F#), and having the 2nd drop down from his original F# pick-up to the lower A, then moving up to the B (but down an octave). This would not only be more practical, but safer and much easier for the player.

So make these changes as you see fit, and any other ideas you have. I'll be waiting to see what you come up with. :D

It's not ever my intent to give you undeserved praise. Just thought I'd let you know that:

Wow. You suceeded in what I was trying to have you do. A+ for this assignment. You have lengthened the recap of A about an extra 1/3rd, and you had the sense to, instead of mindlessly develop, actually build in development, and help lead to the next section, the recap of B. I really like the effect this creates, and it makes B sound very new and fresh. I also like how you variated the melody in A, it works very well. The new ending works well, too, especially with the fermatas, although I would think it would be more dramatic putting all but the last held note with the fermata back to regular quarters, and having a ritardando into it, rather than bummmm...pause, bummmmm...pause, bummmmm...pause, bummmmmmmmmm!! But: bum, bumm, bummm, buuummmmmmm!!! Like in an old black and white suspense film or something.

A couple of things to consider, in order to finish this piece up: In your build up, in the recap of A, you variate the horns and the violins very well, building up into the next section, but I don't feel the momentum is gained as well as it could be. I feel that if there were more moving rhythms, perhaps created by the lower strings not really in play at that point (or merely holding notes, such as the bass), perhaps just pulsing one note, in rhythms that were gradually getting faster (4/4/4/4/4, 88/4/4/88/4, 88/4/88/88/4, etc.), momentum and the feeling of build-up would be created more dramtically and in greater amount.

Also, the only real playability issue I have about this piece: A written B for horns is OK, but only if used spraringly in a piece, and definitely not (usually) on a softer dynamic. I would OK the beginning of the piece where you use it, because it is at the end of an expressive melodic phrase, therefore will be stressed, but your ending, putting the 1st horn up there, is semi-problematic. Holding a high B (concert E) up there at a low dynamic, in a thin texture regarding the other insturments accompanying it, is not the best thing for a horn player. I'd suggest giving the 1st the G (and changing the pick-up from A to F#), and having the 2nd drop down from his original F# pick-up to the lower A, then moving up to the B (but down an octave). This would not only be more practical, but safer and much easier for the player.

So make these changes as you see fit, and any other ideas you have. I'll be waiting to see what you come up with. ;)

Thank you I am flattered. I honestly think this is the best work I've written so far. I think it is going to be performed in may :D. I can't wait.

:blink: You were totally right about the horn line, I play horn and I could do it all(the ending was so so), but I figure I won't be playing it(I want to conduct it). I shifted the opening statement down because, I think it sings more in that range. I also dropped the ending down as well so that the poor player wouldn't die playing that note.

I fixed the bass up a bit.

I also added pizz. to the ending section.

I hope you enjoy it.

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I updated the soundclick.

midis attached

Nick you still here? I'm leaving for Arizona on sunday and will be back in a week. =) I can't wait. I'll be back on as soon as I get back.

Hey, sorry! I'm not going to be able to take a look at this until Sunday...but I'll post something anyway. You have made incredible improvements to this, and I hope this first lesson will continue to help you in the future.

That being said, I'd like to move on to another piece if you're willing, after I post on Sunday. Think about what you're working on and what you'd like us to discuss. If you still have issues with this one, we can continue with it of course. But I'd like to see some more of your works! :P

Just got back. Are you gonna still review?

Yes! Great work, Karl! I think you have made quite an improvement on this piece, and hopefully it this lesson continues to help you in your next compositions! Nice job.

Next, if you don't have anything pressing you'd like us to work with, I'd like to suggest an experiment for you to try.

I've noticed you are good with form and counterpoint. I'd like you to work on something for string quartet, namely on harmony and chords. Here are the guidelines:

1. 3 distinct sections to this piece

2. Each section will use only one rhythmic value each, and will be entirely homophonic: one section with whole notes, one with half notes, and the other with only quarter notes.

3. Using only homophony, the focus will be on chords and their relationship to another. This is not asking you to write a traditional tonal piece, however. It is your job to figure out a sort of harmonic language for each of the sections.

4. Double stops are allowed if necessary, but they need to be handled correctly.

5. Alternate forms are allowed as well, if you'd like to repeat the first two sections or something like that. (arch form, etc. ABCBA...etc.)

6. Each section should be rather equal in length.

7. There should be no time or tempo changes. Set the time sig. to 4/4 for easy writing. The sections should progressively gain momentum (through the decrease in rhythmic value, not in tempo).

If there are any questions, feel free. Good luck!

Yes! Great work, Karl! I think you have made quite an improvement on this piece, and hopefully it this lesson continues to help you in your next compositions! Nice job.

Next, if you don't have anything pressing you'd like us to work with, I'd like to suggest an experiment for you to try.

3. Using only homophony, the focus will be on chords and their relationship to another. This is not asking you to write a traditional tonal piece, however. It is your job to figure out a sort of harmonic language for each of the sections.

Nothing pressing at all. I'll get on it right away.

What do you mean by harmonic language?

Yes! Great work, Karl! I think you have made quite an improvement on this piece, and hopefully it this lesson continues to help you in your next compositions! Nice job.

Thank you so much. It is ALOT.

By harmonic language, I mean, a consistent and unique usage of harmony distinct to a certain piece. It's like creating and sticking to a certain mood or color- a sense of harmonic continuity and cohesiveness. If that makes more sense...

The soundfiles in my sounclick. SoundClick artist: Karl Nord - Band page with free MP3 music downloads on SoundClick

The score is right here.

Finale 2007c - [Homophonic String Quartet].pdf

I can write up a lesson either tomorrow or Friday, but I'm really busy today (Wed.). Just thought I'd let you know, in case you were waiting...!

I can write up a lesson either tomorrow or Friday, but I'm really busy today (Wed.). Just thought I'd let you know, in case you were waiting...!

Yah, :) . Oh well, I'm working hard on a jazz piece right now so its okay.

Well what happend here?:(